The Don Giller Compilation Celebration Part Three: The Late Show Years

hi my name is Don Giller again presented Here For the First Time In Color the Letterman podcast episode 100 part worldwide pants proudly presents The Late Show with David Letterman worldwide pance the most trusted name in pants and entertainment and pants everyone was aware that this was we were past the Heyday of like the rebellious like yes like Reinventing television Letterman like the Letterman of the 80s where it's unlike anything anyone's ever seen like combination of like he had spent a decade doing that and also you know he was on at 11:30 he was wearing a suit on stage you know he's at the Ed Sullivan Theater it was it really we're on CBS now it felt like we're this is like you know Prime Time day like like we want we want this to be like they wanted this to be like a real like have like a broad audience and I think I think especially for Dave who like Johnny was sort of what sort of the star that he was steering his boat towards like that that that was and also Dave having now spent you know almost two decades on on television honing his his character his Persona like who he is knowing who he was and what his voice was like you really realize like the with will you realize like oh it's not just be funny it's be funny in this specific way yes exactly like Fitz Dave Letterman exactly the switch to CBS for Dave um meant you know and it's interesting to me how the beginning of Those Years everybody was like it's Dave versus Jay yeah I feel I feel like as as somebody who's still watching the show about two or three years into it I think Dave said [ __ ] it I do my own thing I'm wondering if you know Les moonves said to him somebody said don't worry about it doesn't matter y you have a completely different audience yep go ahead and do what you do it's a distinct offering right um as they say in network television it's a distinct product yep yep and and you watched him and it also those are the years when you know he became such a good interviewer oh yeah and I think that's that's The Unsung like you know if you if you kind of look at like you're talking to me about those early years of Dave yeah you know um at late night the early comic Innovation years and you end the on the Lake Show with the years of being really the best interviewer on television Barnard without doubt because he was such a good listener so yeah I was certainly younger and and I was one of the writers who uh had grown up watching Dave whereas before it seemed like more of the writers had been people who certainly not I mean Dave aged as the years went on and the writers kind of stayed the same age because they were replaced so it's like Dave started out with his peers and they started out with people who are like his younger brothers then eventually it turned out it became people who were like his young enough to be as kids yeah um so yeah there were several pieces of it that helped keep the Rhythm and the routine daily which is so vital to just getting that on the air so when we started early on I think the production meeting was at 11 a.m.

um and so I would be getting in around 1015 or 10:30 um and then you know do some odds and ends and stuff like that but then get into the production meeting and I'm notating then everywhere that we need music now obviously each show we know we're going to need bumper songs we know the theme is going to be there but play on for guests and then the real wild card was what music for comedy segments would we need yeah so I would notate that entire rundown and and make that and you know see where we needed stuff and then I would get on the phone with Paul and again this is pre-sell phone car phones were a thing so if he was driving I could kind of reach him but otherwise you better be ready to go he's he'll call in when he has a chance someplace and you better be ready to go with the information right um and then it was just kind of dealing with some odds and ends but the show then would sort of change as the the comedy segments would come in and Dave liked certain things and didn't want certain things and so the music piece would sort of change from that at that point I think they were doing rehearsals at 2:00 for comedy stuff so I'd sort of watch that a little bit and just sort of get a good sense of of what would happen yep and then the band would start at 345 so I'd make sure around 3:30 that people were getting in and everybody was where they needed to be uh and also if there were changes or anything like that throughout the show that needed really extra prep from the band or something I'd be reaching out to them before also again pre- cell phone so a lot of beeper usage um you just trying to get seven people and and talk to them was a bit of a challenge always at that point yeah but the band rehearsal comedy rehearsal would end at 3:45 and then we'd have the the band would come on and they really only had 15 minutes for the cues portion of it the play on for guests um and and any of the comedy music that they needed really 15 minutes and then at 4 o'l then the feature band would come on right and if the guys were working if the CS Orchestra was playing with them then they'd be part of that um and sometimes it was just a feature ban and then they would go and kind of do stuff but I would then during that four o'clock hour I was the somewhat notorious stopwatch Runner because they were so adamant three and a half three and a half that 3:30 was a magic time for what that length of song would be and the producers did not want to budge early on with that that got looser as the show went on but initially it was three and a half and it was like Don't Kill the Messenger sorry but yeah they did not want it to run so I was the stopwatch runner on all of that but four to five and it was a hard out at five o'clock the audience was going to come in and again it was treated like a live broadcast which in essence then that's where I think was so important because you would have never you never felt ready and so you could drag it out until 7 o'clock and keep an audience going and whatever so 5:00 doors would open we're done and you got to get ready because it's going to start and so then the guys would go up and change I would get final sort of Notes From The Producers on changes and get a revised rundown yeah um then get the band down by around 5:15 520 um then you know Eddie brill or you know w-e um I can't remember his last name now uh warm-up comic though whoever was doing the warmup yeah would would do some stuff with the audience and then bring the band out they'd play two songs we do the band first and then bring out Paul separately for the second song so I'd go up and make sure he was ready to go and keep him time cued and everything as well um and then Dave would come out for a short warmup as well for what was a 5:30 on the dot start yep again no budging on that we started at 5:30 and you know it was painful at times because you were scrambling but again in hindsight it was so important to keep that Rhythm and routine because otherwise it does become like I don't know when we're getting out of here I don't know when we're going to be able to do that yeah so the way it worked was you had you had heads of departments you had like the head of mailbag and the head of and the head of remotes and and the stangle brothers were the head of remotes and they were uh and remotes was on Friday when we weren't shooting a show Dave would go out and shoot a remote and do something funny out in the world and they'd film it and make these like three minute packages yeah uh that that would that would air like in the act four of a of a of an episode um and uh we uh um and and all the other writers you were sort of like everyone was a utility player and everyone was just kind of uh you you would get like like really like talking through like the structure of your day as you show up and and you're you're sort of there there would be a meeting in the morning where we' just sort of like talk we we would like have FaceTime with each other and and and and uh not like computer FaceTime but like actual FaceTime I should be clear uh and we would uh um just talk about like what's in the news and and and what are we going to do like what what what are the big assignments that are going to be coming up uh it was sort of where like and then Rodney and then the sangles like the headwriter we'd sort of like touch base with all the writers and then we'd all go off to our like the first thing I think sometimes we would like maybe we would we would I think you we would show up at the morning meetings with uh with top 10 topics that was the thing that you you would show up with and like so what's the topic gonna be and everyone's read the newspaper and everyone sort of like said like oh mayor Giuliani did something funny so maybe we'll do a top 10 about that or you know was there ever consensus people would come with the same thing so you knew you all on the same wavelength or were they all original and different or fresh or did it did it they were uh Mo I mean this was I think this was especially at a time when um you know Craig and I had grown up on on you know the the weird top 10 topics that were like you know top 10 numbers between one through one and 10 you know things like that that like we always loved but when and we still did those from time to time but for the most part there was a real push to make the top 10s topical and have them have them really reflect something going on in the news and so that that was always the and so often people would show up and and Pitch the same thing because you know if there's like one big news story everyone sort of eventually get gets around to the same take on it yep but we would have that we'd have that meeting and I think we would even like settle on a topic I think we I think sometimes we would just like and and it was a time you know we usually I think we still had to pitch things to Dave and so Dave may maybe they would I think maybe like the head writer would take like a few topics down to Dave and and Pitch them to Dave and then y one get approved when it would get approved basically then then we would all Shuffle off to our to our offices and um we would uh the the assignments for the day would arrive in the form of these xeroxes like like the the the headwriter would say okay we got this we got this this this uh topic approved and he would say to the intern tell the writers you know the topic is this yeah and we we want a passive jokes due at 11 o'clock and so you would like you'd be sitting in your office just twiddling your thumbs and then the intern would come by with a with a Xerox everything would get everything was a Xerox and it was like a a a that just said in big letters just written handwritten in big letters you know top 10 things Bill Clinton did on vacation because because maybe the story was like Bill Clinton's going on vacation top are you and Craig in an office receiving this this this memo back are you two in the same in in in in speaking or in uh in voice reach of each other and you start bouncing off each other or is this something that you would do in solitude at this point uh Craig and I were uh yeah we were in the same office we had two desks in the same office so everyone had their own office and everyone everyone got the got the got the assignment with the with the the the topic and and due by 11 11: a.m.

uh I think Craig and I you know early on I think we we we sort of like riffed together and then eventually it became it's it's probably faster if we just like each write up our own yeah like just sit there and and write and and and sometimes if one of us has an idea that's sort of half form but we can't figure out how to word it we would like check with each other yeah yeah but yeah you would you would write them up and then print it out and and uh put it in the there's there was like you know all these different like on the door it's really like I'm I'm it's unlocking my memory of this but I'm I'm glad I'm glad we're talking about this because I I don't want to like forget how things used to work uh the uh like on the door there are a bunch of different like uh uh like kind of like slots like folders to to not folders one of file things like I don't know I don't know what the word for yeah like like an inbox that sits on your there's like a bunch of different inboxes and there would be one for top 10 one for for for mailbag one for remote ideas oh that's so cool do you have a picture one of those do you have a picture of one from back in the day do you have a photograph of one of those like that is I might I'll dig around and see if I can find it but oh that's cool anyway yeah yeah and that that was the structure of your day was like assignments come around on a Xerox and it'll say and so like the things that you could get assigned were like you know top 10 were the big one uh the the the head of mailbag Rodney at the time and then and then us when we took over would ask the writers for uh mailbag ideas because that was something that mailbag was on Friday but it was something we would compile through the through the week and it sort of like it was kind of like the longer the the the stuff that took a little a little longer to like get together because there would be like tape pieces that you'd have to shoot I was just going to say especially if you had a remote or a tape piece that went along with it that yeah which was often yeah and that that took a little more work and and uh we uh um uh yeah you would you would you would get your you would get your assignment on a Xerox and sit down at your computer write write as much as you could come up with as many jokes and then and then print it out and and drop it in the drop it in the box and wait for your next assignment like that that was that was kind of the the structure of it um and uh yeah it was you there would be like mailbag letters there would be extras was a big thing which is just like like a funny thing that Dave can throw to like a one joke bit that that's that's more than just a joke but but like like a little tape piece or something that he throw to in the act one um we'd also would need Act One ideas and and and often like there would be things like uh like know your current events was was a thing I think it was like every Thursday with know your current events and so we would have to write those jokes uh and um and then you know inp through the day also we would we would meet a lot and the writer room for things like if there was like a Dave's Video Collection piece coming up we would like we would watch the clips from Dave's Video Collection and and write write funny jokes about them when I worked for when Carter and I wrote for Le show with David Letterman yeah we learned only after leaving there to Los Angeles and writing on a couple sitcom staffs we learned something that we didn't know because we're such we were ridiculously young newbies on Letterman y on Letterman and I'm sure the WR on the show have talked about this a great thing is when you would pitch an idea for like a video piece you were responsible for Every Beat of it yeah you you had the idea you wrote the script if that script got approved you were handed Back The Script with little check on it it's said great we approve your little videotape skit or your mailbag letter whatever it is go make this then what you did was you took the script and you talked to the director you talked to you talked to everyone involved in production about what you need for that shoot you talk to suam and wardrobe y you talk to these sound effects people you talk to music clearances if you wanted a song a specific song you had to clear that song to use it and you went and you you with the director kind of co-directed and Co you know shot the piece that you wrote you were on set you're working with the actor you're working with the camera people you're working with the director you take you get that shot you take that to the edit room you order up the sound effects you need you call up Graphics you call up chy on you say I need this text you say I need uh this graphical element that that's that needs to be created before I'm in the edit room because if in the other room I don't have that I can't finish it Y and you bring your music you literally back in that day because I was there 9702 we were bringing down CDs we're like okay it's track six input this this is the music we but then halfway through it switches to this other music cut that's on this CD and you handed and you uploaded that those songs and then you chose the parts of the songs you wanted you sat with the editors you put all of the graphics and the music and whatever together the doing that for four and a half years is what taught me how to be a TV showrunner this is the original page on blue paper and you can see the boys they were that in case folks don't know watching the boys uh jiml Holland and Mike Barry um the head writers of Johnny Carson head writers of the emies the Oscars the Legendary Legendary comedy writers and they were big contributors to the mon but they didn't have cell phones only called over the regular phone and they didn't use a computer if you can see this is typewritten a typewritten page old school and signed on the bottom on the blue paper yeah and signed so here's the story behind this December 1997 so um it was a Dave did Christmas jokes obviously around the holidays and there was a joke of mine about some Christmas special some Kathy Lee special some dumb joke and then after that and this was the tag this is the kind of joke that Dave would do that's not from the boys it's not even like a joke joke just sort of a tag yeah he said and then tomorrow it was my show d d Kathy Lee has a Christmas show tonight whatever the joke was and then the boy's joke is and tomorrow night Jerry Springer celebrates the holidays with 15 prostitutes right so um it's so Dave nobody else would say that you know and but it's hilarious and so but here's the thing so I'm in rehearsal we go through my joke you know and we get to this joke and Dave just doubles over at the waist he used to do that sometime if he was laughing really hard and just couldn't stop laughing and I said I said that is pretty funny but like I don't know if I've ever seen you laugh this hard and he looks at me he says I just want to know how the boys came up with 15 prostitutes how did they know and so I call Mike Barry up on his landline and I say Mike Dave just wants to know why 15 prostitutes I'm telling you it couldn't have been more than three or four minutes later when I hear beep and this thing comes through and I gave it to Dave afterward and oh my God so here's what they say so he rewrote the line tomorrow night Jerry Springer celebrates holidays with 15 prostitutes Gabe in answer to Dave's query as to how we came to pick 15 prostitutes had we picked four or 16 prostitutes the joke would have sounded like 14 prostitutes or 16 prostitutes thus dulling its meaning and heavy laugh potential one te prostitude sounds like a strictly personal encounter or at the least a serious break in Springer's regular multi-life format two or three teen prostitute still seems a rather skimpy panel and not very funny yet SE morine prostitutes is too unwieldy a group for Jerry Springer to believably handle on a Christmas special and would undermine any credibility the joke might have with the audience thus five team prostitutes is the only possible number of Team prostitutes that works the alternative would not to be the joke altogether which in retrospect I strongly recommend I mean brilliant just brilliant everything you need to know about comedy is right there that's how much you know because people don't get especially people starting out in standup don't get how every single word every number is considered yes every syllable every letter and I guarantee you that when the boys wrote that joke they didn't think oh 14 16 sounds too much like 14 or 16 instantly just new but when they have to deconstruct it they deconstructed it in perfect logic I I just think that's great and tomorrow night Jerry Springer Jerry Springer tomorrow night celebrates the holidays with 15 prostitutes so that'll be good but you know for me I can't write this way I have a very a very structured approach to it but the structure is very Letterman to this day I write in his voice and I I can't I can't shake it man I can't shake it um and and I use this as an example of just you were talking about the structure of a joke so the typical structure of a monologue joke the and this is the key that I that I I tell the not I don't mean to keep bringing up my students but I have to because oh please do no bring them up bring them up by name give them shout out care I think I think about it yeah um I always say the biggest Pitfall you can fall into because most of my students are stand-up comics and some veteran standup Comics the worst thing you can do is try to think of a funny punchline the best thing you can do is try to think of an an association something related in a completely bizarre and unusual way when you find the perfect Association the joke writes itself so the best example that I think I can give is uh uh and I don't remember everybody's jokes but a joke of mine that uh when Clinton got caught with Monica he hired two spiritual advisers to come and pray with him in the white house so I thought well this is a typical empty political gesture and so I wanted to write a joke about it so I knew it was gonna be a Monica joke so right away I know where I'm going with it so uh I thought so this is the way a joke gets written so now I go through this mental Rolodex of spiritual advisors okay what do they do they uh wear robes well Monica had the blue dress with the stain maybe there's a tie-in not really uh the wine the wafer eating mouth open ah maybe that could get to what else they pray they're on their knees bam there it is there's the association the joke is done now all I have to do is create the right framework and not use too many words so the joke ended up being President Clinton hired two spiritual advisers to come and pray with him in the White House just so we need more people in the Oval Office on their knees and you can see that once knees was there it was just putting words in the right place really was but so it was not trying to think of something funny necessarily it was just what do I associate with spiritual advisers and that's really how 90% of them are written and when the perfect you know uh Association comes out so does a joke and the other thing I just wanted to say quickly about that uh on their knees joke is the first way I wrote that joke was just so we need more people on their knees in the Oval Office which would still get a laugh but not as big a laugh as putting knees the punch word last right in the Oval Office and the Oval Office on their knees and what's amazing is I see people that are late night writers that do this for years and including myself that will still make the same mistake you missed the simple thing the thing but simple thing but the key thing it's something that we should have flipped yeah uh you know what you know what Clinton's done now he's hired spiritual advisers I have a staff of spiritual advisers Paul you a staff of spiritual Clinton has a spiritual advisers and they're going to get together with President Clinton once a week and everybody's going to pray and I'm saying oh great that's just what we need more people on their knees in the Oval Office how this all started how this whole thing began so the jokes really have to be much stronger for monologue than they do for standup because you're taking the 50% of it out of it use being able to sell it so the joke has to read funny on paper the first time so the first thing I kind of instinctively knew was to keep it short like I always tell my students three lines or less on the page and the one thing I see Dave do that I've never seen and you just basically mentioned it is he can stray from a three-line joke and make it 20 or 30 seconds long and he will hit that scripted punch line perfectly there you go his back and hit it perfectly other guys can't do it no you know and the other thing is is Dave had a structure to his monologue a story arc which I've never seen another host including Johnny Carson have he would find the closing joke which the reason we went to Monica is a dirty joke is always going to get a bigger laugh on TV because it's forbidden on network but everybody knew it was about a [ __ ] you know so um we would always close with a borderline blue joke and um so we would find that and then that would be joke number eight and then he would usually pair up jokes six and seven uh you know like if one was about Clinton maybe the next was about Gore and then uh uh jokes three and four and then joke one and two was the I was walking to work through Central Park today saw a squirrel you know and right away the idea of him walk in to work through Central Park people start giggling oh yeah I love what he talked about being on the subway I thought the cab drivers but there was an arc to the monologue no every host is like every standup comic let's see what else is going on you never heard Dave do that so with Madonna you have to understand she is the biggest star in the world at that point and also F every single evening for David lman for Joe and because she keeps doing dumb [ __ ] and funny dumb [ __ ] [ __ ] and uh and it's really it's you know there's an endless amount of jokes about her to the point she talked about she brought a clip did you help her get assemble the clip that she brought that night yes I did because so here's what happened so um uh so yes she I think at a certain point realizes that she needs to probably go on the show um because it's every night and uh um she had a publicist at the a manager at the time um I can't remember it's terrible I can't remember her name she was shar's manager too um okay yeah it's bad I can't remember anyway um she calls up and uh and we start talking about the possibility of Madonna coming on yeah and so she goes okay I want you to talk to mad about this so I get on the phone so Dave is apprehensive about this and rightfully so so yes and and and um and I say well let me talk with her and see how this goes and so I told her I said I have an idea of of how to have a segment that will make you look good that'll be funny that Dave will be comfortable with and you'll be comfortable with and we can diffuse some of this stuff a little bit too and the idea was she can come on and basically say you know I've seen all the jokes you've been making about me and um and and Dave will sort of say I've been making jokes about you or whatever he says you know like I'm not I don't know what you're talking about and then you say well I brought some clips and you say and there will be three pieces of tape and put him on the spot and let him sort of answer to each one of them let him be Dave yeah yeah right so um she likes that idea so she agrees to the booking and uh I go to Dave and the night of the show and I'm like I actually think this is gonna go okay I think this is gonna be fine and um so uh he goes okay I go there's three pieces of videotape she's gonna call for them we'll be in and out and then whatever else happens is fine um I go up to her dressing room and she he's with a famous makeup guy Kevin a coin and um and they appear to be stoned but I don't want to say anything I've never met her before mentioned Indo on the show s I'll get to that too yes anyway no no so I I so I they appear to be something's going on okay so I go uh hi I'm Daniel and she goes and she put it on and she goes suck my dick and I go I what like I'm sort of smiling like I'm not did she just say suck my dick and I go okay and she goes suck my dick and I'm like and at that moment I was like oh [ __ ] I don't I think I'm in trouble and I think there's a different agenda going on here maybe so I start like I start like my my you know radar goes off and I'm like oh boy this could not this might not go well I really at that exact moment and so I Ked three pieces of videotape and she's like that's too much for me to remember and I'm like it's not really too much there three pieces of video you just call from one one at a time kind of thing and she's like um uh and she says um you know well we had a little endo and I go endo and I didn't know what the [ __ ] I mean i s pop but I didn't know I didn't know what Endo or Endo or what the [ __ ] it was and then she and Kevin started laughing and I'm like oh [ __ ] She's Stoned so like it was like it was like and I was like how do you get [ __ ] stoned at this like you know it's be a seminal moment in Television right and if you're nervous smoking pot is not the [ __ ] thing to do right that's not it take a volume I mean whatever but you're and she almost like you know go in and she's like can I swear on this show and I go well they'll bleep you but I guess you can swear kind of thing so I did tell her she could swear you know and that's all she did she went out there and she tried to give Letterman her panties and she had a [ __ ] she didn't call for the clips and Letterman was not happy at all oh I've heard he was and I was really so here's the thing it was two things I was frustrated because I sort of presented it to Dave in a way that everything is gonna be great and it [ __ ] was not great yeah at the same time I knew this was seminal television no matter what happened absolutely so you know famous people were going to be talking about it right famous or inFAMOUS right and the other part the other part of this was that that that doesn't get talked about is that she wouldn't leave she wouldn't get off the set the poor damn Counting Crows the poor counting Counting Crows were making their National Television debut that night yes yes and we'd already bumped I think we bumped somebody else in the middle but maybe not but anyway we were about to have to bump the county Pros she wouldn't leave we kept trying to say goodbye her on the air and Morty said uh to me because I stood next to Morty during the segment get get rid of her I'm like how am I supposed to get rid of her like you just got to get rid of her because otherwise we're gonna have to bump C Crow so I went up to um her and uh and just sort of like hung out for a moment like awkwardly like a segment producer does and Dave's like not really talking to her and she starts in there and it's like wave the audience Madonna and she waves like this and I put on my hand and she takes my hand and I lift her out of the chair and I go wave again and I and I like I I literally escort her off the stage holy [ __ ] and there there's a picture of that moment which I can send to you later if you want yeah because me me pushing because the CBS photographer took the picture of the moment me kind of escorting her on the stage and Dave laughing his ass off because he just saw like I'm draging her off the stage I'll send you the picture a great picture the way I always view these segment notes um and and and the pre- interviews that I did was that they were a safety net for Dave in terms of if everything goes south and he doesn't have anything to talk to anybody about they're there and frequently you know we'd be able to get some stuff that was interesting that he wanted to talk about but there were also times when he just you know went off and didn't or times like with Madonna where he couldn't go through the what was in the segment and then that was sort of those were the moments where Dave was out of his B I think and you know if you look at this sort of you know if and I remember TV Guide put together their sort of for Letterman goodbye their top 10 moments of Dave as everybody did I remember also looking at them and thinking okay eight out of T of these were unscripted eight out of T of these were moments born out of spontaneous need and and Dave's wit and and uh so you know it's interesting we can all do what we do but really like you know you live and die by host and and somebody who can be quick and and and funny like that so yeah Letterman was a a big fan he used to watch the old Jack Benny shows yeah and Jack Benny used to have a running gag he had a singer named Dennis day and he had a his his announcer was uh don I forget his last name Jesus Christ Don heavy set guy I forget his name okay will probably feed it to us in a second they would do a bit where where Don would burst into the studio and say to Jack Jack we just had a flat tire and Dennis has to rehearse a song can we rehearse it here so Letterman heard that on the Jack Benny show and we directly lifted it and it would be Tony Randall knocking on the door coming I just had a a flat tire and Mandy has a gig and we got to rehearse the song He Go it here and let goes well I guess you know just like Jack Benny wow and Paul would have the charts and Paul would play would always we took such great care I remember let himon saying we got to get a song and and he used this term that will blow the [ __ ] roof off the place yes he goes it has to be a song that is just so powerful that it blows the roof off the place yep and so Paul would always build to it and then Mandy would belt out this [ __ ] song that stop the show it would just people would jump to their feet just crazy they jump to their feet and then it would be okay bye thanks Dave and they'd run out and Dave would be like well you know like look at him he just stole the show from me yep he just did the high point of the show how could I follow that that's how good Letterman was that he he he knew to play that moment you know and he knew that he could recover it was great Don Wilson by the way was the yes by way the Drew bore thing you know it's it's funny I uh I will prefit only by saying it was a different time and uh of course yes and you know and I think there's some context that's needed there because it wasn't just me um you know brow beating a 19-year-old innocent girl to flash David Letterman yeah um it wasn't like that at all and and what had happened was um you know do you want me to tell that story you want are you going to go through a bunch oh no no no hey no please tell the story let's let's do it yeah absolutely uh okay so with Drew you know there was this place in Tribeca um and we I live downtown New York called Blue Angel and um it was really a unique place in that it wasn't a strip club it was sort of a cabaret and then like Parson's um art school students were like would take their clothes off in nuns outfits to Frank Zappa songs and dip candle waxs on their naked bodies kind of things then there would be Cabaret acts and jokes things like that yep and you know uh Demi Moore who was researching strip Jesus movie she was in had told me about it and I told Letterman about it and I'd gone and uh and you know um yeah so anyway yeah so I I I think I can tell this story so I told so Letterman one day I told him about it I'd been one night and it had been really like you know like being in Paris and seeing something that you don't see anywhere else absolutely Y and I said I'm gonna go this Friday and and if you want to come along you're welcome to now I meant that in sort of the way that that Dave you know didn't go to the white house he never went anywhere but he lived down in Tribeca and so maybe it wasn't completely impossible sure and I think that he was curious to see what the hell was going on in this place and so he said yeah sure I'll I'll go with you and um I thought he was kidding and um he said I'll see you Friday at dat I'll meet you at the bar uh Embassy Bar which is my buddy uh one of my great friends owned this bar and it was right around the front's house so I went to the bar um on the off chance and he wasn't there and I left and um I knew I like this what is stupid of course it's not GNA go to this and so um he said that he went to the bar and uh was swarmed by people because he never goes out anywhere it was David walked into a bar basically yeah and and then he said it and went home and and uh and so um Lori Diamond left messages on my answering machine going hey you know Dave's looking for you but like was before cell phones so anyway I went back in this this leads into the Drew bore story a little bit so Drew um is coming on the show and uh uh and what's interesting is the day before she comes on she goes to this place Blue Angel and Drew being the free spirit that she is gets completely naked on the stage and um and has the time of her life and it's the front page of the New York Post but nobody had cameras nobody had phone cameras it was just a big story and to her credit she didn't cancel the show because everyone wants to talk to her about this insane moment where she takes all all of her clothes at the strip club sure and I produced her before and she got on the phone with me and um this is before publicist listened in on on everything and she says dan it was the most liberating experience of my life I felt I've never felt Freer I've never been you know never felt better my you know anything like that and uh I I loved every second of it and um I said I've been there it's a great thing I tried to get and so this I tried to get Dave to go one night he got like I tried to talk him into it he kind of half heartly sorry but he never made it and she's like oh my God he would love it and basically um you know talking about her you know and I go well it's his birthday maybe we could give him a little performance kind of thing uh of his own and she's like oh my and now that's the part that's inappropriate on my part I should never have said anything even resembling that so she said do you think you would like something like that I was like are you kidding he doesn't get out he would love something like that she like well how could we ever do that I mean you know it would be really fun to do so um I said well you know truthfully if you flashed him you know you're backward be the audience nobody else would say and she's like okay I'm not sure I want to do this but let me think about it I got to be work out my courage and but it would be really fun and why don't you just you can't tell anybody you can't tell Dave you can't tell anyone it's gonna have to be surprise and not only is it gonna be a surprise um you know but I might not do it you know sure so just tell Paul to be ready with some Vamp music for me if I need it yeah okay great I told Paul then I go and see Morty and Morty was a such a chicken [ __ ] at this moment Morty was mortified I've been wanting to say that forever was Morty mortified yeah Morty mortified yeah now so what happened was I said to Morty I go you know I got this thing where where you know you can't tell Dave and you can't tell anybody but like I know Dave I mean Dave is you know pretty you know he doesn't like this kind of stuff and like I knew I wasn't going to lose my job because I I I figured you know I was okay with that stuff and I said what do you think and he goes it's your call and I go it's not my call you're the executive producer it's your call I goes your call Danny he walks away from me like [ __ ] [ __ ] so I was like okay great so uh I was like [ __ ] it let's try it out I saw Drew went through the segment with her and I said there ready go if you want to do it and that's how it happened it was it was Dave's birthday I guess and she didn't tell anyone she was going to do this and she climbed up on his desk you know and turned her back to the audience and lifted her shirt as a gift to Dave and um people just went wild and everyone in the control room was just howling I mean it was just one of those crazy crazy moments that people couldn't believe and you know something the the [ __ ] Academy made such a to-do about Dave bringing you know Tom Hanks up to do the stupid petrick and roll out the red carpet Hanks could care less Hanks is the most chill guy you've ever met you know it was like he knew we was going to win he didn't embarrass the awards he didn't smch their their their legacy he was you know doing what he did if they didn't know that that's what he was going to do they shouldn't have hired him right you know it wasn't his fault and and I I kind of felt bad because Gil Kates who who did the show I was I was very close to his brother Joe Gates so I knew Gil and right before the awards Letterman wanted to [ __ ] with him and he said to me Morty I want you to go to Gil Kates and tell him that I'm not g to wear a tuxedo that I want to do the show in a suit and I said Dave what do you want to do that for I said the guy's doing a show that a billion people watch the biggest show ever I said a half hour before the show you want to just just [ __ ] with him like that he goes yeah yeah let's do it let's just so I felt badly so I went up to katees I said Gil you got to take this with a grain of salt let himman wanted me to tell you that he's gonna wear a suit not a tuxedo tonight and Gil goes yeah yeah all right don't worry he got it instantly and it was it was just one of those things that you go like God why do you have to [ __ ] with people so here's what happened with peterl um you know he was a great guest he'd been on Letterman any number of times and and uh he was always you know great but I mean it it there becomes a challenge for a segment producer too when somebody comes on a 100 times there are only so many stories you can you know I mean you really like you know ringing the washcloth there a little bit and um so you know there'd be times with like guys like Tom broa who' been on every time a guest y um and so you know I remember as a researcher calling yank in South Dakota after reading his book trying to find new stories in the book when most of the stories were we' heard um and and there was a big thing about repeating stories you didn't that was you didn't do that and even if they were talked about on other shows you couldn't repeat stories that was part of the goal too so yeah um i' call yanked in South Dakota and I found his school teacher and I found his neighbor and like they tell me stories and and Tom was always like how did he find out like you know it was sort of a cool thing for me so Peter tool was a challenge so when I said to Peter tool on the phone and I had not produced him before somebody I don't think I'd ever produced them before because these shows for us in London are a big deal so here's what I'm thinking either you come out on a rope like in my favorite year like you make an entrance that way or you come out on a camel like Lawrence Arabia and so Peter tle being I don't know in the 60s at this point maybe you know late 60s um said uh I am not coming out on a rope and I most certainly will not be coming out on a camel and I said oh please these are such big shows for us it would mean so much and you know and and I was begging them and you know shamelessly begging him and he said I'll tell you what if you find in London a racing camel a real racing camel I'll do it but um short of that I'm not going to do it and I go okay that's fair I appreciate that I watch mark my words I'm gonna find a racing cam so uh I am I uh uh you know we're in London I'm looking everywhere for a [ __ ] racing C I find a zo c i find anything I give at all um but I find this guy and he claims to have a racing cam I like God damn it I knew like I was we were doggedly looking forever and we found it so got very excited brought in the camel and uh and Peter tulle shows up at the studios um Channel 4 studios and we have the elephant doors the garage doors that's where the camel is and I meet him at his car and I walk him to the the loading dock and I go Tada racing Campbell and he goes and he like turns up his nose he goes that is not a racing camel that is a common Zoo camel and like no that's a racing C he's like no it is not like so like and uh I'm like oh no and I think I spent like $5,000 something to get this [ __ ] stupid camel there and I had to get like approvals and a bunch of things I'm like oh please you still have to do it can you please come out on this like no I'm not coming out and I'm like I'm gonna lose my job you have to make this entrance on this and and so he's like he felt bad for me I think and he agreed to sort of do it and he was sort of reluctant and um he goes okay well we'll try it out a rehearsal kind of thing and um so then the part that that's sort of a cool add-on to the story is that we were doing stupid Patricks at night and I was pissed at the guy who' sold me on the idea that this was a racing camel and he was there with his camel yep I was pissed because I'd been [ __ ] had and spent all this money on it kind of thing and I was like okay well you know maybe this thing is salvageable does this Hamel do any tricks at all does it smile will it shake your hand does it wave it tail anything he's like nope sorry son doesn't do any of that sorry and the guy's with who's with them says enjoys a bit of loger every now and then the camel does I go what he's like yeah every now and then I go the camel drinks beer goes yes I go great so I got a oil can a hinein or something y like that for p tul and as he Dismounts the camel after we did the rehearsal and everything he says I have a what you call us stupid pet trick and he opens it and we haven't done this with camel all so maybe the camel would like no camel takes the can holds it up and chugs the whole thing and the audience goes crazy right it was on the cover of this mag British lad magazine called loaded it was on the cover of the magazine next month the cam with the can um yeah it was like uh it was and then Peter tul of course it just it it it makes him it adds to the legend status Peter he comes and and the and the camel drinks the beer and it was a celebratory moment and it was a great moment for me as a producer as well Larger than Life moment um I'm probably forgetting a 100 details but but that's what I remember lend was a nice man yeah then God Rest his soul he's he was a very nice man he had a very nice family he had a lovely wife a lovely daughter he had a son uh you know and he was a good guy but he was one of the old school old old chummy guys who you know used to go to the New York Athletic Club which you know I never liked because it was an anti-semitic Club supposedly yeah so you know he was he would and and he would steal pies he'd come back to the office and he'd have this gigantic pecan pie and he goes I took this from the club you want it I said sure I care I like the can pie and he'd bring pies and he'd bring things and he used to steal them from the kitchen at the club yeah so when we took over at CBS we owned the show yes it was our show so every penny of it was from our pocketbook and the more money that we had put out the less money we made yep less money we had to do the show the less money we had to travel the less money you know we were on a on a tight budget it was a good budget and Wendell used to go into the store room and you'd see him walking out with a case of bottled water you know the every on water but in in a 24 pack yep Bill we you go oh I'm just going to take this home well it's NBC no no CBS doesn't pay for it we pay for it yeah please don't do that and then after he did it repeatedly you know it was one of the on on on Wendell's record he was a he was a well-meaning guy he loved the show he was he he always wanted to do more and we never let him yeah he he he didn't have the comedic ability that Alan calter ended up having oh absolutely not yeah to this day I regret the fact that that we fired him and you know it hurt him and it hurt his his family I think and you know I don't think he worked very much after that and then he retired and passed away and you know I still bear that and it's it makes me sad but Allen was the consumate professional he was hilarious he was so such a pro like he was he would just nail it every time you know he was so good and he was game for he was game for almost anything there were a couple times he's like I don't know about this Jeremy because I would bring him a script like I don't know but then he was always such a good sport and he would end up doing stuff I would write yeah some sketches for Allan and um yeah the I mean the thing that jumps out about Allan is going back to the thing I said earlier about you know Biff is who he is and rert is who he is and the show like to its credit had a very kind of Amateur hour quality to it you know like we we weren't slick professionals which was great and Charming in its way sometimes as a writer it was a little frustrating that you know you couldn't give like a big Soliloquy to rert you know like um he would love that by the way but but but the but the I would say that except for Allen yeah anything you threw at Allen he could do it he would elevate it he would make it better and just like he was just he was such a gift to the writing staff like it it it was just it I just loved his talent and and being able to like give him a script and have him make it five times better um yeah celebrity interview was that that was you right yeah yeah I didn't create it I didn't create it I believe Carter and Craig created it and I think they did one it might have been the GTH paltro one palro palro I and then she he she I think they just that's around the time they left the show and so I think the head writers at the time yeah Eric and Justin who had hired me I think they said can you do the next one and that just turned into this you know we did it to the very end so I I took I I did take that over and it did grow a little bit which was fun uh I mean it largely was the same thing I mean like anything we we we really sort of like drove it into the ground but I mean you know God Allan rest his rest his soul it was um you know he was so fantastic so that was just um you know that was all him I mean like the the piece did grow a little bit we um we added little embellishments here and there really it was just to make it longer because Allen was so good at it and Dave enjoyed it um you could always hear Bill shef tackling with laughter um um whenever if you listen if you watch the on YouTube and and you know Allan says oh you make me sick because you did this and you did that and Dave said that's not how it happened and Allan would say that is exactly how it happened you could always at that moment hear Bill shef cackle with laughter um and and my favorite moment I don't know why was um Allan would say to Dave you got a pencil and Dave would say yeah he goes well then Mark this down [ __ ] Y and every time Dave would laugh and I remember one time Eric and Justin said I think we should lose that line and I I said you can't lose that line lose anything else but that was you know um one fight I won and um they said you're right leave it back in because it makes Dave laugh um but that's a perfect example I'm not laughing those are not jokes really I mean maybe mark down [ __ ] is but it was just more that I don't know it was the way Allen delivered it there was just I don't know it's um it's never the joke that comes head on that makes us laugh it's always that very odd specific thing uh that odd sort of round way round of the way kind of thing that you know that's a perfect example like the actual jokes where you know Allan insults Dave and then he insults the celebrity those were great but it was those little things that I you know really really we found entertaining and which is why we did it for you know whatever it was 15 years oh let's let's come up with a new act four for Allen like and of course Allan was great Allan was probably the strongest pure performer on the show in that unlike all of us stoes he could really sell something where we're all just doing our dead pen thing and he is fearless I don't know if you remember this but for there's a while probably in the early 2000s where they would have him act out old scenes from Fred McMurray movies because I think Dave decided that that Allen at least in black and white bore some sort of resemblance to Fred McMurray You' see him doing these old film Noir things it's like he's really good at this I always heard uh that Allen's character as we knew it was more or less created by Carter Bay and Craig Thomas who preceded me by a few years that they sort of invented the whole creepy Allen weird pervert Allen kind of thing that became an endless source of amusement for all of us yes uh and then when they left I think Lee and Jeremy kind of picked up the mantle and really became the uh the strongest writers for his bits like I Lee uh was the one who came up with the Allan cter celebrity interview uh that was his uh format and it was it was a great great piece that that we did so many times and always just killed and it had the benefit of seeing the his guest reacting to the awkwardness there were a few times when I guess I don't know if Lee was busy or if he wasn't there that day or something a few times the sangles asked me to write one of those so I I wrote like maybe three or four of those which I was very happy to do but I'm sure if you watch them they come off as sort of like a weird offbrand version of it like it was okay maybe made in a different country and translated into a language then translated back you know which is hilarious in itself by the way yeah so I I I did the uh the RC Cola version of the Allan culture 7ie it's it it tastes kind of like the real thing but it's a little bit off and I did a few I thought they were okay but I'm sure if you asked Lee he would say he meant well but it's my bit so I always felt a little guilty about that there Lee is a great guy loveely I still work with him actually um uh but like I did one later on in this show it was actually for it was it was uh Robert Nero and Dustin Hoffman yeah uh were both on the show that night so I guess they decided well this is a great opportunity to do one of these celebrity interview things and I don't know if Lee was busy or whatever so they asked me to write it and I I did my best to sort of follow Lee's template and try to do things that wouldn't you know wouldn't do any disservice to what he created and uh I I thought it went pretty well it ended up getting cut from the show I heard someone say it was a little bit too mean Allan or Allan was being too mean no no no that that that Allan might have been being too mean to the guests oh to the guests okay at hofman like like I don't know um the the the footage does exist out there online I believe yeah from a hurler or something and and I I thought it was pretty good uh the the one line I remember you know because it's Dave complaining sorry it's Alan complaining that that that that Dave stole Allan's Thunder yeah Alan weeks trying to book his guest for the celebrity interview and and who does Dave have on tonight right before Allan the same guests so it's it's it's Allen yelling at Dave for oh I've just watched you sucking up to these guys for 20 minutes oh look at this and the one line I I wrote for that I thought I like this you know talking about Dave sucking up to Justin Hoffman was you know oh it's so disgusting if I want to see a senior citizen dof Dustin Hoffman I I'll watch The Graduate so I thought that was a pretty good line I think we did it at least once I like Allan calter makes your company's product sounds sexy just some weird thing like that he really was and I don't know if they fully understood this when they hired him he was another Ultra powerful secret weapon for the show in the same way Paul schaer turned out to be the perfect foil and balance for Dave and we locked out again and again like rert he was just right there he I don't know if there was only a few interactions that Dave would regularly have with people one was uh Jack Hannah and other times if it was Dave talking to rert but my my comedy damaged mind would be set free from its shackles and I would just Roar with laughter at what was happening with with Dave talking to Rupert and he just happened to be there in that Deli when we moved there and he's just this charming good good-hearted guy who would just nod and sort of look ruul or Placid or whatever and just what a what a bizarre wonderful chemistry that that was with him the Allan cter Punch Out pieces where we oh yeah that started as one we just needed a funny payoff letter which is what we call the fourth letter in the mailbag where you you thought you could go out on a big laugh on something that was a little Punchy this is literally Punchy Allan gets insulted by a viewer who writes in he says to Dave hey where where was that person located and they say it's you know Mike Chisum in Van are you are you in Vancouver is that where you live uh just outside Vancouver yeah three hours away from Vancouver yeah yeah they say it's Mike Chisum outside of Vancouver and da where where was that letter written from I was Mike Chisum in Vancouver s that's great thanks he leaves this he leaves the theater and then there's this intentionally long Prett taped piece of Ellen like walking out getting a cab he goes making the track y making the track and he goes he finds Mike Chism and he punches him out and it's exactly what you think is going to happen there's no twist The Twist is there's no twist and then he comes back and now you know a minute and a half of network airtime has been wasted watching Allan go punch out a guy that insulted him and there's no twist to it and we did so Dave enjoyed this Dave liked those pieces you find that Dave for whatever reason he liked how dumb it is he liked that there was no twist but then over time we did it over and over again and there started being little twists like Allan wound up punching out uh re just filed yeah punching out I think at one point he punches out I believe himself in some incredibly sophisticated split screen technology if I'm not mistaken that happened once unless I'm inventing that but there was just like an elaborate series of these and just like where else but a five nights a week show could you just sort of find a way to drag out drag out and belabor something like that I loved doing that I love that the old late night show would do that and and there were pieces that kind of could come back and evolve and characters Chris Elliott the guy under the seats you know oh yeah you'd be watching and you would hope that these recurring bits there'd be a new installment of some recurring bit that that idea of having the real estate across time on a TV show to find ways for these ideas to evolve it just doesn't happen it doesn't happen in a movie you know it doesn't and a lot of sitcoms it didn't happen but when you have that was the great like playground of a late night show and and Late Show in late night with David Letterman because it was this thing where there was five shows a week and you could just try stuff because of that and it was sort of this big canvas that you could paint on and you couldn't do weird stuff every single night but you could there was enough real estate to sneak in these weird subversive bizarre ideas and and every now and again those ideas kind of one of them popped and it transcended and it it it felt like it spoke to people and then you could find ways to bring those back and play with them and there was not those were all of my favorite things when we could like build those out and find character Alan calter I felt like we found Alan calter as a character we would write so many these elaborate florid crazy speeches for him and bizarre pre-taped pieces like he was a singing duo with his twin brother oh that was so good oh my God that was soter for the ladies we would any chance we could we could do have Alan e either give a huge long monologue live there on the stage or could could spin him out into a pre-tape piece anything we did with Pat and Kenny over time sometimes Tony Mendes finding I was gonna ask about Tony Mendes if you had any Tony Mendes yeah and finding ways to kind of like find those characters Tony Mendes was like this like hot head firecracker and would freak out and storm off and like finding ways to sort of like Define those characters Allan like when Sue would come on and be rap Dave oh my God yeah yeah and like I think those are my favorite things and when I connected to the rest of my career I'm like I think it's because those were like hints of character development I know it's funny to say that about these little late night bit The Late Show Bits but there is there's a sense you were finding alen's character you're finding Pat and Kenny what like what they were good at what their comedic strengths were and those are actually the same things you need to carry into a sitcom as you find out what those actors superpowers are and call them out and have the sort of time and space to do that over years and seasons is a is a gift and I I think that's a real crossover between that long of my career on Le show and and and like H your mother for example those are the people I find funniest in general people who can say who can make you laugh by not saying a joke not saying a punchline like you know Chris Elliott to me was maybe the best I've ever seen like I feel like you know stepping away from the show I feel that way with um you know Amy po M McCarthy can do it um Bill Murray can do it that you know it's and but Allan was so great at it yeah um and then we would write scripts just because we wanted to we really want just wanted to see Allan perform I always loved that we had I was just talking about this with Joe that I L that we had a cast of characters not just two or three people we had like 10 12 15 people and it's so funny that I don't know why I mean this might be the stupidest uh comparison you've ever heard but it just like a couple of weeks ago it made me realize that we were kind of like the Muppet Show in that our show was not the show our show was you know like when Dave would say you know sometimes we'd write things about oh uh the celebrity is in his dressing room and we cut to that or you know I just got a message cut to the receptionist our show we were also showing or pretending to show how the show was produced we were showing scooter back back stage with kerit and like that to me is what made the show so fun is how much we made Believe took place backstage you know like the cold open of Dave with George Clooney or Dave with Tina Fay and you know that to me is is was such a fun it's what made the show so fun to write for yes is that it didn't have to be da we could show it Harold La I've shot a ton of pieces with howold Lin and let me tell you he really is people would ask that question a lot of times like about the different people we would have on the show like George Clark and Harold Lin and I'd say no Harold Lin really is our head Carpenter Harold is a brilliant performer yeah I mean to the point where it used to surprise me um like we would go on field shoots and um I would talk into a mic into his ear and I would always try to wait until they stopped talking say no you could he was like a new like a news Anor he'd say no talk to me while I'm talking I can do it and I'd be feeding him lines as he's having a conversation and he wouldn't miss a beat I never knew how how he got so good at it but he really was a natural Harold was the easiest person I ever shot with um but you know it was that really is is is what I loved as p as a person who was helping put the show on but I also loved just now as a fan that I I love that kind of that that's what the show was that yes this is Dave you know like Dave was almost playing the part of a guy hosting a show that was terribly run even though it wasn't obviously the only reason we lost dominance was because we got [ __ ] in prime time and didn't get any leading yes started going older and it was Matlock and this one and that one and you know all of a sudden it wasn't the audience that we were craving and know they had musty TV and they did younger shows and they had friends and they had this and they had that you know something that's how we lost wasn't about the quality of our show and his show it just so happened that it coincided with Hugh Grant's appearance on the on the tonight's show yeah and that happened because uh Hughes publicist you know he was a desirable guest whether he was caught with hookers or not he was a pretty big yet so they be out of fairness and the publicists would you know they were very fair they would alternate one movie Letterman would get him first one movie Leno would get him first so that movie just by luck of the draw Letterman uh Leno got ug Grant first and got him the night that after he was caught so you know that that was the the spark plug that brought on the defeat but but you call it a defeat it wasn't because people watched it and liked Leno it was because people happened to have watched it and it was about the time when the season was changing and yes they came to and said look Dave hates that we're number one Jay Leno billboard as he should and he wants to have his own billboard great let's do a billboard okay and he wants to say we're number three I went you got to be kidding me I mean you know my instinctive reaction was are you crazy and then I went you are crazy that is great that's gonna get more and so we bought a bigger billboard down the street so you could see the Jay Leno number one and the Dave's smiling [ __ ] eating grin we're number three and you know what God bless him no the the the best I gotta tell you again seriously all we were we were happy conduits of his great humor and ideas not all of them got through but most of them like this one did okay I gotta ask you just you just opened the door do you remember one that didn't get approved that they threw out they saying hey let's do this and you guys are like no that's that's too far do you remember one off the top of your head no okay I don't I just remember we would go kind of like uh really and you know they would go back we would go back somehow we and there be a compromise yeah but not often look as I said Dave's a genius and his work was genius and it was true to Brand he wasn't going to be told or you know he wasn't going to read a script yeah you know he was going to make it what he felt was his brand of comedy and we were true to that it's the audience who have to respond not Dave that may have been the funniest thing the show ever did uh it's so good I I've heard I'm not positive I think that may have been Rob Brett's idea I can't I was not there I've just heard about it but just seeing that picture it was it really encapsulated everything about Dave and what made him in my estimation so much better than Leno who is a very talented comedian yes yes of course Dave was just someone who had this other non something else you couldn't identify that just made him really special Ovitz and I hatched a plan and the plan was what if Disney buys worldwide pants and if Disney buys worldwide pants and our library and our assets and our commitments from CBS Everybody Loves Raymond we hadn't done the pilot yet if Disney buys all that one they pay a fortune for it two Michael Ovitz and David letman would be partners and he'd be back in business with Ovitz holy [ __ ] Morty I've never heard this this is that's amazing Why didn't it happen at the time Letterman and and and this is how I suisee it happened I think there were other factors in my getting fired but I had always kind of put two and two together where there were people that when oit's left they ascended to be the the point person for leaman okay abler and Jim jackway who was LE him his attorney and Fred Nigro his business manager okay and I don't think they wanted Ovitz back in Letterman's life so when they caught wind of this secret proposal that Ovitz and I wrote uh they turned against me and I think they convinced Letterman to turn against me that I was out for myself I was out for the money whatever it was but I became very close so when I got fired the night that I got fired I went back into my office and I called Ovitz who was at Disney and I Saidi can't believe I just got fired he goes good he goes you'll you'll come here you'll be Lauren Michaels of Disney of ABC blah blah blah blah blah I'll give you a deal simultaneously he was negotiating with my girlfriend at the time who was Jamie Tarsus and she became the president of entertainment at ABC so he couldn't give me a deal because it looked like she was giving me the deal which she was Ovitz gave me a deal there so I had to wait like a year before I got a deal but Ovitz had promised me and took very good care of me and when Ovitz was at the on the outs there I I'll never forget going up to seeing him to see him at the Disney headquarters and he was in this gigantic office he had not a paper on his desk and and he broke down crying and he said I don't know what to do here Morty what the [ __ ] do I do he goes they call this building the team Disney building there's no teamwork in this company I mean he's sobbing sobbing and I go Michael you're better than all this D blah blah blah blah blah you know trying to play Kaden and he goes Morty you're the only one that knows I have a sense of humor you and Dave know that I'm funny and that I could have fun I'm not serious and and it was a very interesting conversation and shortly thereafter he left funny story the night I got fired uh um Mandy Patinkin was a guest on the show and Mandy I I so I I was friendly with Mandy so he calls me up that afternoon he goes Morty I have an idea he said I want to do some magic tricks for Dave he goes you know I have four or five he goes I don't have anything to talk about he goes I really want to do these magic tricks for him I've really done them well and and I think he'll enjoy it so I said all right let me talk to him about it I go to let him in and I'm sure in his mind he knew he had a fire me that night it was the night I got fir so Letterman says um Letterman said I say to Letterman I said manand he wants to do magic tricks what do you think of that he goes no he goes what am I he goes what am I supposed to do act surprised when he does a magic trick I have to fake being surprised why he hated getting gifts on the show right never like to be surprised with a gift because he'd have to Fain appreci apption he had a Fame that he liked it whatever it is so he goes I know all these tricks he goes what am I going to do I go wow I'm amazed he goes I don't want to have to act and and and react that way so I go to Mandy and Mandy goes well I have nothing else Morty I have to do these tricks so finally I convinced let him and I said let him do the [ __ ] tricks what's the big deal right I'm getting a hold on so one of the tricks he wants to do is where he goes behind Letterman's head right and now Letterman had a thing with his neck Letterman claimed that he had a broken neck yes claimed that you know he was in a car accident whatever it was and that he broke his neck so Mandy had this trick where he would get behind Letterman and he'd go oh boy and it it wasn't supposed to squeak it's a dog toy with a water so he had a water bottle under his arm and he'd go no not supposed to no I hear no we hear it a water bottle yep so it sound like cracking his neck so everybody like goes oh he touched Letterman's neck oh my God and Letterman looks at me you know gives me the around the camera look and I knew he was pissed so after the show he calls me into his office and he fires me now I of course think it's because I let him touch I said Dave he goes it's not about that he goes want to make a change blah blah blah blah blah you know so that was uh so anyway I go back to Mandy I go back to my office and the phone rings and it's Mandy and I had just gotten fired and he goes Morty is is Dave pissed off I'm so sorry blah blah blah I go Mandy it's okay don't worry about it I gotta go all quiet yeah so I rushed him off the phone didn't tell him I got fired years later he he said to me he goes you got fired that night he goes did I have anything I go no man you didn't blah blah so it was funny I get fired from from the Letterman show yeah and part of my exit deal was that they were going to give me an office for a year at Black Rock the CBS headquarters and I was on like the 32nd Floor yeah they used to call it the Bad Boys floor because anybody that got fired and had an exit deal they would give an office on that floor so Eric obber who was fired as the president of CBS News he was on that floor I was onor and it was the bad boys Flor Flur so you know they gave me an assistant they paid for my assistant they gave me a beautiful office overlooking six Avenue Big View wow for a year you know I didn't have much to do I was kind of you know looking to figure out what I was going to do for a career and um so I used to have lunch every day at at the China Grill which was in the lobby of the CBS building yep so one day I'm having lunch there and I see Cosby and moonves together having lunch and I I you know I would be there with magazines reading and eating alone and I had to pass them to get out of the restaurant so of course I passed them and say hello and Cosby goes in front of moonz he says this he goes I can't believe you got fired from that show he goes you were the heart and soul of that program he goes you were the papa bear you were the I of that show he goes I will never do that show again now that you're gone was like Bill that's so sweet of you thank you and in front of moones and you know mes wow you know mes is even impressed so in the moment yeah I'm like flying high thinking what a great thing that night I get home watch the Letterman show put it on tonight Bill cousin me yeah he was that night he taped it at 5:30 right after lunch he promised he's never gonna do the show again so I knew Bill Cosby was a liar from that day on there was a certain amount of kremlinology of uh what has the great leader said and what are the implications and what might have been just a irritated tossed off remark is now in shr as some sort of inviolable rule and then later no I don't I don't hate that I don't know where you got that idea why it started yeah so you you do your best to try to understand an Ever evolving ecosystem of rules and preferences and and uh at some point you found that oh but this contradicts that well that's the nature of the game just like every day the the mood may be different and the the show evolves and the world evolves and now we're going to talk about this and we're going to find our own way to put an imprint on something like after 911 the classic dilemma of oh my God the world has changed how does comedy fit into this very different feeling world and the Very tentative ways that Dave tried to test uh are do we want to laugh do we think we should laugh at silly things and are we still fully human beings that have all these impulses not only grief but optimism and laughter and yes we we found our way slowly back to that uh yeah yeah we were right materials because because because you had to but yeah it was a day to day daytoday finding your footing I you know I I I I the I mean the first thing that jumps to mind talking about this and I don't know if this is true but like I seem to remember just you you know like the analogy I gave about cramming for a test when you come in in the morning you know and and and you you tear through the newspapers it was very strange in that during that period you would come in and you would tear through the newspapers and it would be nothing but news you couldn't joke about you know like and and and so I remember us you know I before I was talking about how the the balance between topical humor and Evergreen humor I remember during that period it was just like you couldn't make topical jokes because it was just grim and and like I remember it's just like I I think at one point like doing a top 10 list about the Jolly Green Giant just it was silly and it won't hurt anyone's feelings or make people cry um yeah so I remember that being an odd time I I I was not a huge fan of George W bush even in the days after uh 911 so I I kind of very quickly wanted to get back on and and making jokes about the administration criticizing the administration Dave was kind of wary about that like we need to we need to hang back and so yeah yeah and so that went in my memory it went a couple months and then I remember there was a weekend in I want to say December or J January where the president um had bruises he had abrasions on his face and it was it was because the president uh choked on a pretzel and fell down and hit his head on a table and bruised his cheek and thank you God I remember fine again at at that point Dave kind of nodded and went yeah okay I guess we can make fun of this guy again like I think I think Superman has lost his cape I and then it was uh I had to take two weeks off which was kind of unprecedented we didn't take my time off if we could help but uh I was going to get to be in The Blues Brothers movie sequel and I had to go and shoot it for two weeks they liked everything the same you know so I was trying to figure out who am I going to get for two whole weeks and it was our talent U coordinator at the time was Sheila Rogers who suggested what about Lauren oh my goodness the one guy that Dave would be happy to look look at and see you know if I wasn't going to be there so la was able to do it he started doing covers like we always do he came in with various things written out like a Spice Girls Arrangement written out on store paper Warren what you know anyway that's another story we work faster than that yeah Dave you know I'd like to hear Warren songs when he does it so when when he would do it it would be all his songs yeah actually for bumpers play on everything uh nice of him to be able to do it and certainly that last show what can you say that was real television he did he sent three songs yeah which was hard on anybody to rehearse three and then do them right away at the air show but he you know man was absolutely dying and it was amazing so let me paint the picture we are you know he was supposed to do the show John McCain was a big get you know he was a friend of the show running for president it was a big booking right y y and uh and there was a big financial crisis going on at the time and he used that as the I won't say an excuse it was like okay I got to get back to Washington because he was still Senator we got to vote on this thing so no one questioned it and uh the show went to their go-to guy the modern-day Tony Randall go to oh my God we need some a warm body in the seat it was Keith Oberman Keith always delivered was great so Keith is there uh to paint the picture in the control room I'm on the back deck I've got like like a very getsmart type office phone not not a shoe phone but like a 60s it's a it's a beige phone with a line you know very officy right yep uh and uh it was two to my left were the two CBS technical guys um one of one of the two would be there you have to make sure everything's okay with because I'm not wasn't a technical guy so they were the technical Aon me shaky uh Kathy bakus uh Paula um another producer and Jude on the end right so we're in the back there sit there and right behind Jerry all right Jerry Foley our our incredible director and a monitors see people know what a control room looks like a monitors and it's all the different feeds but because we were CVS we had access to feeds at the broadcast Center so the broadcast we were on 53rd in Broadway the broadcast Center is on 57th and like 10th Avenue 10th and 11th Avenue black rock is that what it's called no no no Black Rock was on 52nd that's where my office was the broadcast Center is an old was was an old milk factory believe it or not two levels but and it took up the whole block between 10th and 11th Avenue and that's where 60 Minutes happened and the Morning Show and and Katie cork the evening news right and occasionally we would get those feeds that were that were coming in yeah so we're sitting there uh watching um Keith Overman and we'll be back with more Keith after this and there's a murmur going on and I'm not pick I don't understand what's going on like because because Jerry because they're talking on talk yeah yeah we're gonna we're gonna punch it in hold on one second and then I I I look at the screen and I see I see Katie corck is interviewing John McCain I'm thinking this has got to be a [ __ ] tape this can't be happening now oh my God so I know what they want to do I applaud what they want to do right I think it's brilliant but holy [ __ ] you can't just do that without me just making one phone call not not to stop it but to say this is happening because a heads up by doing this you know our feet is out there too and if Dave's picking his nose or someone's doing something silly that you know what's to stop uh one of the other CVS shows for taking that footage you know it just becomes really ugly but this I I ENC I think there was a great idea so I hear them said they're about to take it someone tell Dave da da I said hold on wait wait wait a second right and then I'm getting like push back right and I and I Jude and I go outside the control room to have this conversation and I said what I just told you it's going to happen we're going to do this but I have to call lesie I have to give him a heads up that you know this amazing TV is gonna happen so getting back to what I said earlier as far as managing my lesie I wouldn't never say lesie what do you think we should do that's not fair to him he's not in the moment so so it's literally I get under my deck because that's the only phone that I had on that crappy little phone and I'm whispering it's like main was supposed to be on the show he canceled the last minute because he said he had to go back to Washington but it turns out he's on Katy cork right now Dave's got defeated he's about we're about to put it up it's gonna be incredible TV all right I just want to give you heads up okay kiddo great thanks boom and then boom it happens it happens and it happened at a time where somehow it got picked up I think we put it out because there was always that window of time where technology started to to get wider you know where you could actually have a website that might actually have streaming video because we went through well in 96 it wasn't there and by by I want to say 2004 whatever this was it was I think we might have even given something to Entertainment Tonight like we were feeding it because it was because Dave was oh yeah what he did with that was amazing right I remember my wife calling me going what is happening over there are you okay because I'm seeing this all over the news I'm like you have no idea but one of greatest moments it was one of the greatest was it was great and then and then the great thing is uh Weeks Later whatever was mcain coming on and you know the road to the goes right here right through here yes and you know you know what happened there I screwed up you know that little oh was such a it was so good and and and like you said thing about Dave is the thing about Dave he's so forgiving the minute people have the nerve to show up right like I think he did it with Hillary too there was a lot of bad in of Hillary yep I think she shows up on the show she finally did was was the night he went in for open heart surgery too by the way that was like another crazy thing oh that's crazy the day before yeah oh my God this is like an acid trip once we got the ear monitors yeah and we could speak to each other unbeknown to anyone else in the world game on and thean musicians are every musician I've ever met is pretty much someone who could have had a calling as a comedian also and just the jokes cracked constantly during the show I mean it's you know it's nonstop it is nonstop the things that that I'm hearing in my ears saying in other people's ears yeah yeah that went on constantly Mike constantly yes speaking of on the edge uh sir on the show we're on the show one day and Dave's doing the monologue and this was my 15 seconds uh Dave's doing the monologue and he says a guy in Kansas City got arrested yesterday I never have done this but Tom Malone mentioned about the guy I having sex I whispered to Paul on inter I said he wanted to come into money so so and so Paul stops the show Dave Dave my trone player has a b punch line and he and the show stopped for like two minutes and was like where are you at the me my God but the band has to write some material quite literally now they're ready the comedy too where hour ago and Don Giller take note to this moment and throw it out there please get it out there right now Don Giller has documented so much about the show he'd be a good guy oh oh Don hey Don is uh we're eternally grateful for everything that Don does behind the scenes with us and the factchecking and all of the ideas and everything um this episode this episod c as well too real very intelligent guy I'll give you a great schaer ISM that that we took advantage of the microphone by having the microphone that nobody else could hear about us yes first of all scha I don't know how he did it man he must have been some kind of you know he had 12 Minds going at once because he had the ad talking in his ear at all times he had Dave to to to respond to he had he had what what was Dave was you know when Dave wasn't talking to him to respond to the the the room itself you know and just to set up the band and also to be a bad [ __ ] on the on the on the keyboards which he has always been right yes genius on keyboards and and everything I don't know what you know just the the brain and listening to people make mistakes and you know making notes while we're making the mistakes and everything yep um but one of the great advantages of of that microphone that he was so genius about never talking into the wrong one of that's the genius because that could have been pretty interesting yep um his father um was a was a really great guy and uh Bernie schaer and he had this uncanny ability according to Paul to to uh to call out somebody's wig hairpiece uh black spray paint on the bald spot you know those kind those kind of things it's a hell of a gift and yes he he could nail it every time and I think Paul got that inherited that Gene as well oh so he would he would point out you know when people certain people would come on he would point out one of those it's a weave it's a thing plugs he he would just you know and we were just go really and then the more you look the more you realize man he nailed it so fast you know so that was one of the great uses of of the microphone well back first of all all the credit goes to segment producer Maria Pope who was working now on for Jimmy Fallon but yep just in the spirit of you know by now we were totally into doing play on and making little secret points and Maria was into it and Mar Albert had had a sort of some unfavorable publicity whereby someone had pulled off his yeah you know his hair his hair really and said in the Press I pulled off his wig yep and he said it's not a wig it's a weave so Maria Pope said why don't when he comes out why don't you play Green weave that was a no-brainer of course I'm going to do that and sometimes there was some judicious uh uh you know uh is it Barrel rolling back scratching Jerry mandering you know like some PA y some PA who was just about forced to move back to Iowa because they couldn't pay the rent so we'd cast them in a couple of bits over a two week period and they would earn enough with the under five $200 here $600 there but Paul schaer you know they would play music in and out of the breaks uh uh Bumper Music and um he when when some uh uh musician was in a tough spot or needed dough he would play their music I can think of many examples but the one that come to my mind was uh Sly you know from Sly in the the Family Stone yes and he would which was great music to play anyway sure Paul would go out of his way just to sort of like you know without you know in a legitimate way help out a fellow professional and a artist you know I love hearing that yeah that was sort that was a great thing all unsung and all unacknowledged the whole spirit in which the show existed was that you know it wasn't necessarily for everyone you know it was uh that's why you felt like you were in a club you know so that's why you know I think there were you know there were things that people people loved and hated the quiz machine even with our within our own staff you know so I mean you know that that was Universal there were probably people who hated the weekend Late Show on the staff and uh um uh Dave any Dave loved it and Dave um Dave particularly liked it when I don't know there was I don't know how many episodes in it was when it took the turn where we where Bruce says something that I think Bruce says the kids are with their mom this weekend in one of the sort of like in one of the what sounds like an ad live back and forth and Dave and Dave Dave just loved the fact that like this sort of be story was gonna was coming out between you know we were just hearing about Bruce's marital problems in the promo for their dle weekend so anyway I I don't know I'm laughing because it because you know again when when something tickles it was funny it was great well but you also you know you also everybody will say this but when you make Dave laugh about something you know it uh it's everything you want so that was very satisfying when he found that funny well the one thing that sort of became our uh consistent uh way to contribute to the show was um I don't know if you remember Dr Phil's words of wisdom that yeah that went on every night basically for I'd say at least a year oh yeah you guys drove that one well yeah and Dave just kept wanting to do them um well they're great yeah and it was so like they were so easy to find but uh Gabe and I had to watch every episode yeah that was us and we pitched it originally I think as a um it was part of like a new for fall thing or things that the show was going to be changing and it was just supposed to be like a one-off thing that every once in a while we would hear a little bit of Dr Phil's words of wisdom but I remember distinctly like knowing that you know daveid had his whole Oprah thing the Oprah log of you know her not calling and all of that which I think was Carter and Gregs also um but uh knowing that Dr Phil was coming out of the Oprah world and i' had seen like oh this this guy from the Oprah show is gonna have his own show now that is definitely going to have something that we can use for da you know that it it's going to fit into Dave's World somehow and so then it was just a matter of like how do we use it so I yeah I remember recording uh you know on on my too the first Dr Phil Show and like okay let's see what what we can work with here and there's a lot yeah there is a lot but um yeah just narrowing in on that way to to use his and he just you know set himself up for it time and time again like anytime he would sort of you know whenever any metaphor or simile that he gave totally and he like takes their you know speaks in the Persona of the person like I'm I'm just a big dumb idiot or whatever like I've had giving us those yeah it meant that we had to watch every single episode of Dr Phil and that became a regular assignment for us and we would we would switch off who was doing it on a given day but um it was more like scanning through and F forwarding anytime anyone else was speaking and then oh yeah he like okay here we go like he's Dr Phil is going to talk again I want yeah I remember it was a big deal when Dr Phil was going to be coming on the show for the first time after we'd been making fun of him for so long yep and and I don't think we knew at that point that he had such a great sense of humor about himself um it was like this will be interesting to see how it goes um and he quoted some jokes and stuff yeah when he was on the show you know um so it was nice to see that he was playing along but you're right yeah it was a uh it ended up becoming more than just those bits but the great thing for us was that like in in in one way it was like nice to know that we were gonna have something on the show every night just about sometimes there were two of them in a night um the downside was like it was very much a formula and like you said he was beating it into the ground it's like okay maybe it's not always as great uh you know is coming up with something new was fun also to see like that the audience after a while started to know it too and so when the when he'd introduce it people would start to you know yeah it was just written as a one-off and yeah I remember yeah the sangles came to us and said like okay we're gonna need more of those like get ready to watch more Dr Phil so yeah they would um yeah Randy and her her gang would uh send us the tape every day of the Dr Phil show we scan through it yeah for me you know I did a lot of traveling right so uh I would go and help uh be like sort of the field producer for like Biff Henderson's America segments right yeah so like I would go it would be like a director who would go and it would either be Randy grak or Jessica Santini uh and and a writer would go and Biff would go but you know you know I was just learning on the job at the time so for example you see Biff driving that Winnebago all the time but that's only in when the camera's rolling when the camera's not rolling Jeremy's driving the Winnebago right so you know when we were the first time I ever did I think was like Calhoun Missouri and I was driving the Winnebago or actually I think the it was the first time I was driving this very big winnabago I backed it right into a ditch like within 10 minutes of driving it you know what I mean it was ridiculous yeah and then you're driving and you're responsible for getting the whole crew in the Winnebago to the location so here's another example we did this we did a defend America in I was thinking about this the other day we it was in Whiting Maine right and I was talking it was Chris Harris was the writer and they wanted to do a joke it was you know the joke was was gonna go on a lobster vessel he he's gonna go on a lobster boat he's gonna pull up a lobster trap and in the Trap is going to be uh an AOL CD uh because those were everywhere at the time okay and then the joke was going to be oh God these things are everywhere right so this is my first time doing this sort of thing so I'm like here's what I'm going to do I'm going to call a authentic lobsterman I'm going to set this up we're going to go out with a lobster vessel we're going to put the CD in the thing and we're gonna shoot the joke right so I call the guy he goes awesome we'll take you out in the boat you have to meet us at 3:30 in the morning and we'll be back by Sundown because they're gonna go out lobster fishing all day and that was the first time I realized I I realized wait a second I gotta think this through I got to figure out what does it mean to produce this joke do you know what I mean and so you know I stopped down thought about it for a second I called a a lobster restaurant in the nearby town and I just said to the guy you don't happen to have a like a boat that could take us he's like of course so within 20 minutes we were on the guy's boat in the harbor he he put the CD in a trap and dropped it so it wasn't as um organic and natural you know what I mean but it was one of those things I was learning to produce the comedy on the Fly uh and saving us 12 hours in the on a boat for one joke do you know what I mean I might be about this but I bet you if you ask most of the writers the same question again I could be way way off on this the thing that we most remember or we're most fond of is probably the the oddest stupidest silliest of course it is instead of like yes this one big piece that I I did that was you know four minutes and this and that and no like when I'm together with with you know Joe and and and Steve the things that we kind of joke about or the things that we remember most fondly really just entertained us I I can't I mean I I'm I'm sorry I'm giving such a disappointing answer like I just I can't remember one specific thing I mean like for instance oh Joe's gonna love this on um on just on on Friday Joe and I watched a clip that I wrote along with Jeremy Wier where so NASA had developed this uh urine purification system so that astronauts could turn their own urine into potable water and um so Jeremy and I wrote this thing where Dave says and look we have footage of the test in in uh you know in action and Joe plays an astronaut and he there's a big machine that says I think Ur urine purification system or something and he drinks the this big glass and then he picks up and then he just you know picks up a plug and he says forgot to plug it in still you're in now it's as stupid as you could imagine but for some reason like something like that I remember with great fondest and I know Joe does I believe Jeremy does yeah um it's not that it was the funniest thing I ever did it's certainly wasn't or the most memorable but it's moments like that and I think it's because I mean the one great thing about that job was we always tried to make Dave laugh and the people in the room laugh more than the audience yeah um you know I mean I'm sure Dave probably wouldn't be thrilled to know that like we didn't care if the audience laughed because I know he did I would assume he did you know he's the one who's got to sit in front of 400 people just staring at him but um if I could make Steve laugh when we were having dinner I was you know thrilled or if Steve made me laugh you know also keep in mind at at The Late Show probably at all places um but at Lao these things happened as a throw off uh as a throwaway like Jeremy and I were writing something and I really don't remember what Joe's first thing was and we just said what if we get Joe to do it that's it that's it and then there's always like this you know you don't know how it's going to go you don't know if if uh how well the performer is going to do you don't know how well the piece does you don't know how well uh Dave's G to respond to it I mean there's a there's a number of moving pieces that could you know kill something quickly but I think once you see Dave enjoying it it's like well let's get Joe to do it again and then it it always always always worked and um you know so uh um yeah but you know for me I just feel like I'm very much the every man I you know whereas saying Joe is not at every man but I'm just saying he certainly does it's easier to do an impression of Joe than it is to do of me um and you know it's uh Joe brought something special he really did I mean you know he'll probably roll his eyes at that but uh but it's true it really was he was always very good I'm happy to talk about every appearance I did and and whatever things and I I know you're very effusive in your praise of of of of the writers and everyone else about the show um but I have to say I can't really take credit for much of any of that uh I don't think all of my appearances I think were written by other people I never wrote myself into the show y um I wasn't like you know Lucy saying hey put me in the show make me a star no uh so it's like the other writers sensed from the beginning oh this is a person who's not very comfortable with attention so therefore what we have to do is give him the attention that will create some sort of a awkward magic um but you know Dave always liked having staffers on rather than actors playing characters so anytime you could turn a staffer into a character that was helpful and especially if it was someone who you could tell wasn't really entirely comfortable being on the air I mean that's how I mean ruper G he's a smart friendly guy but you can tell not exactly you know Mr uh you know he's not super telegenic and like you know let let's let's entertain America you know he's like he's trying trying to sell sandwiches and here comes a camera to the de oh he'll be friendly but like you can tell he's not dying to be a star and you know Biff and uh you know Pat farmer and going back to the old shows you know alarah or uh you know Larry Bud Melman you know he was an actor but just barely an actor and and and the thing that they all have in common is they kind of probably don't belong on camera right uh they're not super uh photogenic they're not super charismatic they don't have any discernable Talent so of course it's GNA be fun for Dave to put them on there and and and see if he can kind of milk some awkward uh energy out of them so I was very very uh pleased to be one of those people who the the show latched on to in that way I never expected it or or imagined it would happen but the other writers were very kind enough to try experimenting with me like that like before the show I remember there's one story I told a couple of times but before the show calber had to go to the restroom and this was in the year 2000 so it was it was uh the guests that night were Crosby Stills in Nash and Al Gore I think because it was election season wow so it was a weird night there because secret Services all over the place you know there's bomb sniffing dogs there's you know this iconic rehearsing and Calbert he has to go to the bathroom which is right across the from the sound effects Booth under the stage yep so I take him from the alley under the stage to the bathroom I'm waiting outside the door I think I'm make a small talk with like Gary gell who's the sound effects guy who did all the glass crash sounds and everything yeah next thing I know four Secret Service agents uh come down the hallway and sort of push me aside and then I see Al Gore who goes right into the bathroom while Calvert's in the bathroom and all I hear is Calvert scream and I just see Al Gore walk back out and I'm just standing there like what just happened like you know Calvary gu just didn't lock the door and someone told out Gore the bathroom start across from sound effects let me tell you a very funny Tony Mendes Story please this this might be a little inside but what the hell uh I got into Dave's office one day he said guess who just call me I said I have no idea he goes uh by vice president Al Gore really yeah yeah he said Dave how many times have brought on the show said well you know a few times Mr Vice President he said okay I'd like you to do me a favor I'm teaching a class at Columbia and I'd like you to uh come and talk to answer questions from the students they said yeah sure so he talked about it thought about it and he called he called Al Gore back and said uh can I bring some of my people with me and I go said sure he said and uh I'm thinking about bringing Tony Mendes who my qard guy uh and he's he's a Cuban Exile he was he's a refugee his family fled Cuba and he would like to come uh in full battle fatigue like uh fidal Castro is that a problem he said yeah you probably shouldn't do that Dave yeah that's okay so anyway we went and did it it was fine you went and did it not with well we went I we were up there with Dave oh not with the fatigue though no me I guess it was me me and Bill shf and uh a couple of who else uh staff members maybe Mary Barkley maybe Joanna I don't remember but anyway I do remember this one of one of uh one of Al Gore's staff members was with us and it what those Al and Dave up way up ahead and he turns to us and says from this point on I think we should probably refer to our bosses by code names and then he said my boss's code name is and it was something like Gargantuar who knows something silly and I thought we're on a goddamn ivy league campus in New York City why why would I didn't think I didn't say I just said no sorry code names what are he playing some kind of game that way that he could tilt reality 22 degrees and it sounds plausible but it's completely not right like uh one of my favorite tiny things yeah that uh that I have quoted to friends over the years I don't know what year this would have been mid 90s I guess based on when the movie came out he he was talking about that movie uh speed yes and his capsule description of the movie Speed was that it was about a talking bus nuts really takes people on some kind of crazy seems like I don't think that's right but it almost sounds plausible yeah I looked up to Steve Young as man if I could ever be a third as allaround funny and useful and good in any situation as as Steve is then then I'll be I'll be fine because he was such a as as a writer who'd been there for a long time but had never but hadn't you know lost a step or hadn't never felt like he was he was going to start to run out of ideas is which is just breathtaking to me you talked to Steve Young right you said a couple of times absolutely Steve Steve like the writers sometimes are my best friends and sometimes they created massive headaches you know like uh he pitched um we do a Civil War reenactment on 53rd Street right with two you know you have two different sides you have you know different guns there was like they were going to fire a cannon right and so it was my so it was Jill found the people and it was one of those things I had to help Wrangle them all that day yeah and Jack Hannah was on the show that night who he brought a water buffalo but the water buffalo couldn't be near the cannon so we had to move the water buffalo around the corner and then in rehearsal um we didn't shoot the big cannon because they didn't want to waste the I don't know ammunition or whatever sure and um but then the actors who were re they didn't want to they didn't want to pretend to die because they were on TV and they wanted to be on TV as much as possible but the whole point of a Civil War reenactment is some people have to get shot and you know and it was just insane and then we did from the mind of Steve Young let's let's from the mind of Steve Young I I I could be wrong but I'm I'm I'm pretty sure it was Steve Young and then I remember during the show just everyone is shooting their rifles or muskets or whatever and then the cannon goes off and it's just insane and it reverberates throughout the entire neighborhood and then it got so Smoky with this it was just you know I saw a lot of crazy stuff the writer because we look we're a late night show yeah we come on after the average viewer has consumed a fair maner news so you know you could say one of our mission statements or our mission statement is to um kind of give the comedic spin on something they've seen in the news well some days it's just really no news slow news day and slow news day and that used to turn into kind of the most fun day and and we always still talk about it was a Wednesday and Steve Young and it was just a brutally slow news day I mean look I I I yearn for a slow news day now but and Steve Young wrote this whole piece about hump day it made no sense I mean it made sense but it was just that we're putting on a 30 second or however long piece about it being hump and it was like such a great performance by Steve it's like what could I do how do I turn something a nothing into something yeah that is what I remember most fondly it's yeah you know there's a joke about whatever about Clinton about Bush about whatever um but you know to be able to just create your own premise which is the hardest thing and you know create something at a whole cloth and Steve was always so good at it um that's what I remember um um so clearly that was one of those things like Steve Young was always the best at coming up with you know the random thing that seems so obvious but it's so funny you know like one day we we were it was like a random middle of the week and we had nothing for a comedy segment and he ended up just pitching a commercial about uh you know hump day and it was uh you know different questions about people and hump and it was just one of those random funny things about it was just a commercial for hump day because it was the middle of the week and we had nothing else to talk about and there was nothing topical you know what I mean just people would come up with and people could have come the way he approached things from such a unique skewed point of you was just awesome and a lot of times you know you know Lee and Steve and Joe they would they could just come up with something so clever and unique that bailed us out of jams time and again you know you learned if if if you found your way there to trust like in the writer room I I've heard of terrible writers rooms where everyone is paranoid everyone is scratching for credit if I win you lose so I must win and you must lose there's I think no shortage of rooms full of like that yep talented but not necessarily beloved people who populate certain branches of the industry but we were lucky with uh a very longterm stable core of people who were comfortable enough with each other to say uh I have the beginning of something but I don't know where it goes or I have this phrase and it may be stupid but I'm just going to throw it out there people would make themselves vulnerable on a daily basis in the writer's room and say w whatever this is in my mind I don't have it you're going to have to help me and maybe together we can make something that neither of us could have made apart so on a good day that would be like somebody else pitches the beginning of something that I couldn't have thought of but then I add the detail that make oh my God now it's a slam dunk yeah two people together on a in a room like that or more we did things on a collaborative basis sometimes that were just everybody helping but that took confidence that you believe these people are not rooting against you it's trust it becomes a trust issue yeah you want to do well you want to be funny you have that ego and you want to keep proving that you're worth the paycheck so if long time goes by and you're not getting anything on that's not good but you're also feeling like if if Tom rupe or Joe Grossman has the best idea today and the show is great tonight well we've all won we know it'll be my turn next time or next week or whatever and not all shows get to that uh sort of collective Trust and there's all these other ways things can go wrong uh along the way uh production bottlenecks and uh some news story flares up in mid-afternoon you have to rewrite the whole show to be about that and throw away this other good stuff that you were excited about so yeah you just learn to trust people hopefully if it's a good place like that and not agonize about what what did get on hopefully over the Long Haul you'll have some Hall of Fame pieces you'll be glad about that they beat the odds and got on and were triumphant like one I remember is just one of these silly ideas was fairly late and I think I did write a song for it it was just oh like a little music bit would start oh you know what that song means folks it's time for my grape break and there was a grape Break song and a grape lowered on a a filament from the catwalk down to Dave and and and and the way I wrote it it was just going to be like in a little box and he would open the box and eat one grape and it would be just a lot of effort for something nonsensical but Dave kind of got a hold of it and said oh you know what put the grape on a on like a sewing needle and then he did this long thing where he's trying gra in his mouth and you see shots of that stage hand with the fishing pole with the grape on it and it it was such goodh humored chaos because Dave was in the right mood that day and said this is going to be stupid fun and and and I couldn't have predicted how it would turn out some days yeah Dave would take something that you thought was this level and make it way up to here just decided to run with it we also did MacArthur Park with Jimmy Webb on piano y will they singing singing lead and playing bass at the same time on camera like so I got to write that whole big giant uh Orchestra for that French orange strings brass you know woodwinds will that's like a famous per that's such a famous performance in itself I can't really say that that's part of a group of things that happen like that that was very that was very special very special and Will was just awesome he was so good oh my God and he's playing while he's singing that which is oh my man and blocking he's moving around he ends up on top of the cake like he had end up on top of the cake yeah and then hit that high long note at the end I mean he was just man I have to give him his proms will Lee is so major he is so wicked he is such a genius and so so gifted such a badass and maybe he gets the best guy award I had to wear a device in my pants for uh to get that high note anyway um seriously though that was it was a harrowing experience because first of all you're playing and you're singing at the same time so you gotta like figure out some some kind of you gotta fake out some kind of way to coordinate those two things and to either like pay attention to one or the other to not screw up the whole Orchestra you know so you screw up one and that's going to throw everything off and you screw the other one and it's going to throw everything else off you know so got you got the bass playing you got the singing and I had written out like a hybrid kind of chart for myself to to appear on the teleprompter oh no [ __ ] that kind of let me know you know basic it was a lyric thing but but also had like some hints about what to play you know I have it somewhere I don't even know it had just enough information for me to be able to pull this thing off but the physicality part of it um you know I had my vocal coach there um I was kind of bummed because when I sing on stage I have enough I have enough breaks in between phrases that I can just go to clear my throat if I need not not when you have the Madonna mic on when Spears mic on every sound is heard so animal yep I did you know I did tons of pyc tons of uh just down a few gallons of water my vocal coach was had warm me up all day long and uh we had the the basic band you know without the strings and extra hired you know horns what Etc Jimmy Webb had a rehearsal one night because we were learning bumper Tunes okay and Letterman had sort of said you know could you guys try to do MacArthur Park as a as a bumper right I I believe this is how it went Paul bum okay Paul schaer who's really more on the inside will know more about about the exact way it went down but to my knowledge to my uh from what I've heard we were we were rehearsing it at the bumper at the bumper rehearsal rehearsal and um we you know I think scha got the sense that I could sing it pretty okay and thought and went and maybe he went back to Dave and said um this you know we don't know exactly how to treat this as bumper because it's such a such an epic piece of music yeah where do you start where do you end but it's it's got the potential to sound pretty good you know and I think he talked Dave into and Dave said well let's do it as a feature or something like this that my order of events is maybe way off but when that means you know Paul negotiating for can we get strings and can we get can we build it up and do a thing can we get a prop can we do a cake thing and whatever meetings went into all that stuff right and the funny thing was you know I'm friends with Jimmy Webb he's a really wonderful human being and a good friend and I was excited when when I got the call to say Dave wants to do this as a feature and I and I even had a date that I knew it was going to be and I was able to to call Jim Web Jimmy and say look I want just want to let you know that I've been asked to do this your song this is M par thing and don't want you to miss it you know are you going to be anywhere near a TV set on blah blah blah whatever the date was I think it was like in July or something how cool is that that's awesome whatever whatever it was GNA be he got like really emotional about this and he said he said um man yeah because at this point this it had been announced that the show was going to be ending at a certain place at a certain time or whatever it was known that the show was going to go away and and that's what he got at most I said man I'm going to miss this show so much I watch it every night blah blah blah and then and then a light bulb went over my head and I just thought wait a minute I gotta see something are you gonna be in New York at that time you know and he said well I'm just coming off a tour yeah I'll be in town I'll be around you know when that's happening I'm G and I said you know let me call you back in a couple minutes and and I went over and I to my memory and I think Schaefer had already had this idea but I think it's my idea but you know I went to those guys and I said can we ask Jimmy can we invite him to do this with us you know and which because everybody said yes including Jimmy it was like the Saving Grace for me that that that day and night of doing that because I have to tell you that he was so into it that he was like a little kid he was so nervous he had to play that intro that har cord intro that he hadn't played since the actual recording with Richard Harris he hadn't played that since that time and I think he felt a great deal of of like pressure and responsibility to get that right so he was just like I was I was chilling him out which cooled me out which really gave me the the freedom to to go ahead and just do it you know yeah you know in between breaks I could see how nervous he was I'd be hey man it's going to be great you know and I'm over there like yeah who's telling you it's gonna be great I needed one of those to in my ear but instead I was Jimmy's guy ladies and gentlemen welcome to another episode of MacArthur Park on the leg that's right um only that it was it was different like once we knew that we were doing our final shows it felt different even though we did the show the exact same way it just felt I just remembered that it just it just felt different like we and and I think we all felt so grateful yeah we we were grateful to David and to Paul and to the universe and to each other you know we we really felt that's that's what I remember feeling amongst us all that we were very grateful we weren't we weren't really sad yeah you know what I mean it's like oh yeah yeah it wasn't like oh God it's over no that last six weeks was a celebration there's no question it was a celebra yeah it's like we would we would have wanted it to continue of course but it was like okay well hey there's nothing to complain about like we we had a great time we had a great run it was more than what you what one could even have expected it to to be so it's like hey you know sometimes you gotta die because nobody can live forever you know like and and it's nothing to be sad about you didn't nothing bad happened it's just it's just what it is and and I just remember we were very we were very happy we very happy like we knew it felt different because we were ending it but at the same time time we were really upbeat really nobody was down in the dumps or anything like that no afterwards I was goingon to say the crash comes after yeah remember being depressed for like six months I didn't get out of bed till like one o'clock in the afternoon you know terrible