Scott Ryan Returns To Talk Conan’s Return To The Tonight Show and How He Destroyed ‘Hot Ones’ Forever

you're watching the letman podcast with Mike chisen endorsed by the hello Deli yeah welcome once again to the Letterman podcast my name is Mike Chisum uh Scott Ryan's back and I'm I'm so excited that Scott Ryan is back because he is one of my favorite people uh and the author of last days of Letterman which is and you know Bill Carter Jason Zinman you're both amazing you're both amazing writers I love both of your books this is my favorite Letterman book of all time I have mentioned it a bunch of times uh the this book Chronicles the last six weeks of Late Show with David Letterman the culmination of Dave ending his run on late night television and and it does it in such a beautiful beautiful way because it is the interviews of everybody who was involved and uh it's an oral history so and he's got a beautiful interview with rert in there and and all sorts of fun little extras little serps lots of Letterman trivia that if you it's just worth the read and uh there's been a lot of folks who who who hadn't read it who have watched our show and read it and gotten back to me and like oh why haven't I didn't I didn't I read that book back in 2017 2018 when it came out it's so good now Scott has written a whole bunch of other stuff he's written a whole bunch of Twin Peaks stuff he has written um you know uh he's got a new book The Moonlighting book is incredible uh that he wrote as well um and again another oral history on the series of Moonlighting fantastic book like I cannot endorse it enough I'm we're going to talk about that today as well uh but he's got a new book about uh the last grade decade of Cinema which is about the 90s and n and and movies in the 90s and it's a really powerful uh read for the folks who are ciles Rick copile from a few Generations before that those of us who grew up in the 90s there is a very special bond that many of us have when it comes to the music in the movie movies that came out at that time and and uh but of course Scott and I talk a lot of Letterman stuff the first part of the conversation is all Letterman and Conan and lots of Co cool Conan current events and things and just uh really good to connect with my friend again um yeah let's get to it folks the Letterman podcast is proud to present the return of Scott Ryan you gold I mean gold and you weren't recording I try not to be recording when people enter the room immediately I want Goa I want a gotcha you don't think I need a gacha of a gacha are you coming to the Pacific Northwest anytime soon because if you are I need to come down and hang out with you are you going to do any Twin Peaks things anytime soon Hey listen I actually am coming to the Pacific Northwest are you I'm going to Oregon is that considered the Pacific North West it is it is considered when are you going to Oregon uh the first massin game is crazily going to be in Oregon at the Nike Stadium really the NFL is flying the Tigers out and as you know I do a show and I'm going so I'm gonna be in Oregon like Tuesday Wednesday Thursday whatever that week is the August 20th or something like that you're kidding oh man I don't know is that considered Pacific Northwest it is it is I was of course thinking uh Bend Twin Peaks right Twin Peaks stuff yeah but uh but that being said um okay so let's talk about the Tigers for a second because I I think that this is just the most it's one of the most delightful things you and I have had very similar um we we we we we're still should you introduce me to the damn show do I not get an Inu I do no I do a separate intro and everyone knows how much I love you anyway but yeah I mean Scott Ryan is here again and we're so happy gosh I can't believe I'm on the show last days of letter now which one is that is that the secret secret one the secret okay look we'll we'll give a little bit of behind the scenes the original is actually on the set as well you look back behind Steve Young's book oh yeah I mean by all means where I like my books is to be covered up with someone more famous than me's book there's Steve Young's there's the original but this is the super secret right only you and I twoed this yes that one there and that one goes right here yeah it's it's so beautiful I wish we could sell it I know it is it is lovely um yeah the super secret edition of the last days of Letterman I've said it so many times and no offense to Bill Carter no offense to Jason zinaman and everybody else out there my favorite Letterman book of all time is the last days of Letterman I love that because that last six weeks is my favorite um my favorite run of any television show ever is that last six weeks of uh of of late show and you went out so for real though I mean because this is the thing that I I know that everyone loves Dave on NBC and of course I love Dave on NBC I'm not saying I don't love Dave on NBC like abely I mean that was you know where we found him where he found who he was yep but there's to me I feel like we're in the minority do you think most Dave fans would would ever pick the final six weeks you know it's funny um when I when I make the the argument or not the argument when we when we talking back and forth with things most late night fans will kind of yeah okay it culminated in something amazing that final six weeks was absolutely magic almost everybody can agree on it but they will say but late night was still better um you don't get those final six weeks if it wasn't for the early Incarnation phases of of Letterman and what they did you don't get those six weeks if it wasn't for building a strong Foundation to get to that place um but if you were to if you were to frame it without the last six weeks if you were to frame it late night versus Late Show yeah I mean a lot of people are very staunch about that and they and they they like late night um a lot better it's the same thing as when your favorite Indie band and we've used this analogy on the show before your favorite Indie band where you go see them gig 120 130 people and you have this religious experience and then you see them again a month later and you have this religious experience and then suddenly that band goes big some of those fans don't go along for the ride at that point we just had a television historian who's a huge Conan fan um and when Team Coco rose up she kind of went in the back seat at that point it's I think it's a it's a it's a human condition of some some sort well I always think of that with remem because that was sort of my you know I sort of rode with RM and when out of time and automatic for the people really blew them up so many people are against that but those are great albums it's not that the other ones aren't great too but you know those are a level more and so I would submit those last six weeks are the out of time of David Letterman I mean that's what I would say but um there is a Perfection to them um and we're going to get to we have so much we have so much to talk about and we're gonna and it's GNA all like tie in to why why everything matters and it all comes to those six weeks and so I like hearing that because I didn't I knew that you loved the last six weeks I think all Dave fans did but I didn't know you as well believe it's the best run I I agree with you there's nothing like it no Conan's end run was great yep but it wasn't like they did on lman it wasn't it wasn't the same no I I I uh like and don't get me wrong I for me I remember because it was it was our and you and are similar age it was our formative years don't tell people I don't want to be I don't want to be linked to you please I mean look at your beard look at my beard that's true that's true I do want to be linked to you well I guess it I guess it depends on what the goal is um the uh Carson's right so late shift one when late shift one happened we were in our formative years we had Jason Zinman on and he we talked about the cult of Letterman and and when we talked about wait a minute when you had him on did you tell him you liked his book best I didn't I didn't I've had Carter on twice and don't get me wrong I love these books but yours is my yours is my favorite because it's a love letter it's it's it's it's uh um and they all have their their strengths to them um and and when Jason was on uh we talked about you know how how Letterman versus Leno say that there's like there's a cult following there you know um you know and and I'm not saying there's not the same for Mr Leno but to me it's not it's just a different it's a different deal and and he talked about how folks who during their formative years when Late Show late shift one happened um the cement was kind of still wet and so many of those people who who either attach themselves to Dave during that period or were attached to Dave during that period and they were in their formative years they they just had this U allegiance that would just just showed up differently than it did for other people during that time we saw Carson's last year Carson came on late night and said oh yeah I guess I I guess that's it and that that day at the upfronts he went on late night that night and and and basically kicked off a year um retirement you know um um Last Dance and it was good it was very good you watched it as a kid I watched more tonight show during the last year uh probably cumulatively than I ever had because I mean it was in my my second last year of high school and um so I I watched a lot of that and then of course the late nights like I you probably remember this too the late nights of that era were there was a lot of juice to them the the late nights of wondering what was going to happen while The Late Shift was going on and and uh then of course even when when Leno got the show we don't talk about this very much but there was a time where Leno was Letterman's lead in it's like for like nine months right right um we had Don ker on a while back and we talked about that like what was it like having Leno as your as your leading and it was so funny like they're all such alternative uh gen xer mentalities they're like oh we're way better than those guys like they just they had this Swagger about them and and so I watched a lot of that and Carson's leadup this is all to go back to Europe Original Point Carson's gby I don't even remember my original point so I hope I don't have to I don't have to bring it up to it no it's okay because you wrote a book about it um it uh um Carson's leadup was great his his leadup to his retirement was awesome and then there's the B Midler moment and and and all these clips along the way and and and you could see where in that last six weeks they took cues from Johnny's exit but to me it was just way more way more special on Dave's um about six weeks before like right around the time you started the book it was it was during the first one of the first or second shows where they started showing Clips the show just Rose in everything it Rose in energy it Rose in importance it Rose in in in in in people paying attention to it and it turned into this different thing and it culminated in that amazing Montage at the end like I don't know if that last six weeks would have been the same thing without the Montage at the end like it was it was absolutely perfect if it was a symphony orchestra every single act was brilliant and it finished perfectly um that's how I see it I mean totally and I the thing that I remember most about that night is that my DVR stopped in the middle of it but I of course had stayed up I gave strict instructions to my family to leave me be I watched it alone in the dark no one was with me yeah I just I wanted to be alone and then I was like wait a minute I kept looking at the time and then I saw the DVR stop and then I immediately like was going like a crazy man to record y it and I mean just that little thing like the world has changed so much it's ridiculous to list things but just that you DVR Dave like it was set up for you that's how you watched it you didn't think about it it just would happen that way and because of the this is what I always tell when people ask me which of my favorite you know which of my books is my favorite and I always say the Late Show but not because of me but because I'm the one that broke that story of them getting that last episode on and it shouldn't have been me and I still have never seen an article about it like you'd think that there'd be something in um Late Show weekly I don't know it's been a while are there magazines anymore yeah no no no well I don't know have you watched have you seen late nigh.

comom yet no okay good uh I'm glad I can and share it with you I want to share it with everybody there's late nighter docomomo so it starts with a newsletter every morning you get a you get a recap of of of of the four talk shows the night before the monologues all that who was on and if there were any uh any moments that need to be you know you need to go back and see it all that kind of stuff but then also uh articles into the history so for for Letterman and um and the the Grand Puba of of late nighter he and I have talked a couple of times and and and he he's a huge huge Letterman fan so they want to have call backs to the past as well so they had an oral history you know sounds familiar of the Madonna KN of Madonna's infamous I did see that I that was on late nighter that was on late and so so I think that we should probably get a story on what you're talking about at Rupert's retirement I met one of the editors from that night name is Andrew and he told me like he's like it was not because a bunch of them didn't make the party right because they went long and the Montage at rehearsal went really really well but then it got a little hinky during the actual uh show itself and so as you reported in your your book that show literally went to the broadcast Center the satellite truck whatever it was with minutes to spare and some of those folks didn't make the party Andrew was telling me like chairs were being thrown across the room like it was not a happy time uh during that because of the because of the length of the show and some of these things that you you talked about in in in last days of Letterman yeah it's one of my favorite things that um you know I remember when Barbara gains first told me that story was blown away that that I was getting to hear this as the first non- Letterman human um which was I mean we probably were doing those interviews in 2017 maybe yeah I was gonna say two years after the fact yeah yeah because I mean it took me a year and a half to get Barbara to say yes so which is crazy I know I know I know that uh I know that pain I know that personally I know what it's like to try and get Barbara um she's she's busy with show of course of course the barber gain show uh just celebrated their 50th Episode by the way happy uh Happy 50th of the barber G show um she's been so kind to me every single time I've had an encounter with her and I appreciate her um uh yeah she's just she's she's she's so quirky and cool I just really appreciate Barbara um and we just learned that she's the mother of Mary which I did not I mean that was news to me it's good that we can learn things they kept it under wraps all these years well you know uh a parent child illegitimate relationship is always something you want to tread carefully on and it's nice that they're able to uh to let us all know um you know they haven't really said who the father is but we know it's Alan calter we know it is I mean I I don't know if I'm talking out of turn but I think we know big red spreading his seed um his big red seed that's uh that's a beautiful little notion there right there uh we had alz on um not too long ago and and he talked about how there was a standing I think it was a standing Thursday golf game uh with with uh with him there was there was Allen there was alz Allen calter um I think it was was it Bruce it was either I think it was Bruce and uh and Anton and they went golfing every every other week together and and he said he just he he has so many Allan calter stories you know he he's forgotten more Allan calter stories than um than than some of the things that you and I have have have heard it just what a sweet sweet man and it's I love every time his name comes up and the fact that he is now the father of Mary Barkley that just even makes things more special it's just my it's my theory we'll see keep watching The Barber gain show I think it's going to be a running storyline it's unfolding as we uh as we speak um speaking of which okay so I want to talk about your Tigers because this is adorable to me this is can can we tell everybody how uh what's the Genesis of this and what happened with the Tigers and they won the whole damn thing and I just can't believe that they won the whole damn thing um yeah so I mean I have a book out called massin against the world yep the massin Tigers is a high school football team from my hometown Masson Ohio um and in that town football means everything to them um it was the town that was in consideration for Friday Night Lights to be based on it was between that town and a town in Texas and they went with Texas so you know it's it's a very famous town for football but we had never won the state championship um on the field before and we did this year and you know it it sounds trite but it's really the greatest thing that's ever happened to me in my life like it's all I ever wanted I am not a sports person really I don't know anything about it hence I host a show a weekly show about the mouse and tigers um and I interview the coach and two players and it's just basically me being an idiot about having no knowledge about football despite having gone to the game since the 70s like I I don't understand anything about it I just wanted to win and we finally did so I got to do a book about it where I interviewed all the coaches and it it is so exciting to me uh the benefits just like myself the benefits of having a podcast studio in my house the benefits of having a publishing house uh and and knowing how to do that like I want to know how was the uh how big was the run that you did was it just for you know was it this is a this is a unique commemorative way to celebrate this moment that is uh a lifetime in the making for multiple lifetimes in the making for for for from a generational standpoint this would be a cool keep is that how that what was the Genesis of the book I mean for me it's not about football and I think that's the rough part maybe for to get people outside to read this book but I think you'll be sucked in because it you know massin against the world was the name that the the team sort of used as their mantra for the year they would come out with a flag that said m against the world and you know you're sort of like well well that's not true is your first that they're a high school football team they're not facing the world and they wanted to call the book masin against the world so I really had to think okay if we're going to do this why and the truth is it is massin against the world because massin is a small town and I don't know how it is up there for you but in America they're doing everything to destroy small towns and this this truly is a town that supports a team this is not you know a fake um pooling of of people that come to this school that don't care this is within the town of massin and it's all they care about and so I write an essay in it which is one of my favorite things I've ever written called mine against the world to sort of explain to someone from the outside like how could this possibly be and you know I talk about we don't get our p piz from Pizza Hut we get it from K's you know we don't get our ice cream from Ben and Jerry's we get it from heggies and you know like there's all these small businesses in massin including a cable company they don't have Time Warner Cable they have their own cable company do you know why so they can broadcast the Tigers to the town because Time Warner Cable would come in and say no you can't have a channel like what are you talking about you get to see everything and Masson will never have regular cable because they're going to play their Tigers like that's why I have this as the cover there were 14,000 people there uh the town is a town of 33,000 like that's a crazy amount of people so what it's really about is about the last gasp of small town America in this time where were're trying to make everything a kudoba everything a Starbucks and um to me it's about family I my you know I'm sitting in the same seats that my dad had and he died and gave him to me and my son is always looking over at me trying to get me to eat more cholesterol and so he can get his greasy hands on our this season tickets you know I say in masselin they're not heirlooms they're season tickets is what is passed on to the next generation and and to me that's what the story is about so we interviewed all the coaches and um if if you think you know football if you think there's a rivalry in sports you're going to learn what true sports are about there's no money to be one here no you know this is this is about representing your town and you feel that from the kids they carry the weight of a town that used to Boom with with Corp um not corporate but um steel mill jobs yeah and they're all gone now and so how does this town survive it survives on 15 to 17 year old kids playing football for 10 weeks a year and you know I don't know it's it I'm very proud of it we uh printed 600 books and we sold them all in two days I was gonna say yeah that's the Whole Town's gonna want one yeah so we cannot keep them in like I'm trying and people waited in line for two hours to get them signed believe me it wasn't for me uh because we had the coach and the players there and it was an amazing night you know it was not what I was supposed to be doing this year like I we did the whole book I did it with Becca Moore who is the coach's wife and she has a lot of emotion she's with can my co-host co-host is well on the show yeah yeah yeah she is the Kathy Lee to my Regis and um we do a lot you know the show that we do is very Letterman based I've sent you some stuff where I'm putting I'm putting the clip of the commercial uh uh advertising the the the the braggadocious nature of uh of of feed of people being able to watch the feed of the games um howdy friends have you enjoyed streaming your local football games do you want to watch the games from your living room well don't worry about it well you got to come to Spectrum you want instant replay we ain't got that do you like to know how many minutes are left in the game we don't tell you what down is it that's not of your business you want to get by the game early we don't let you how many odds to go yes you don't need to know that are you sick of how the NFL films games with multiple cameras one camera's plenty and it has a rain stain on it what do you need more than one camera for how many eyes you got do you often wonder did they catch that path you won't know because we ain't going to show you again one football One camera are you annoyed that there's a trophy ceremony me too we don't show it we hear you complaining about the buffering we're a cable company we can't provide internet we're going to blame your internet anyway we have a monopoly so you have no choice you got to buy we don't have to offer service we're Spectrum we ain't got that okay so so so you come in with this Quirk that you have that is you cuz you are you're extremely unique and quirky and I love it um and you come in and and and now you've kind of built this business you've done you've done some things or whatever how does this how does this go you approach the team and say hey I got an idea for a weekly for a weekly uh uh uh uh you know video Bal whoo that we're going to do uh to Quirk this up a little bit how do you and and do they see the vision of it right away what's their reaction to this okay I'm first of all it's me and the head coach okay who has so much pressure on him I can't like it's ridiculous he is not a talkative guy he doesn't laugh he hates the media he has a very hard job and I just pitch him and his wife you know this Rinky Dink idea that I'm like hey there's no really good coverage why don't we do it I'll host and I'll talk to the players every week and the wife loved it she knew me a little bit and she she likes comedy and she knows I'm funny but she didn't they didn't really know what my plan was and I was sneaky about it and so they wanted some other people to be involved and they were kind of editing it at first and I was just quiet because I'm a hard worker and hard work will beat everyone in the long run you know that yep like you're there you're going to be there and and no one's going to work harder than you and when when that happens so you know the first couple episodes were not what I wanted but I just was quiet I'm like I'm going to outlast that editor and I'm going to soon be editing this and then I did a little skit and then a you know and then this year I took over and the skit you're talking about there was a a game that streamed and it was the state semifinals yeah that's a big game we're getting to it and it was you know two hours away from massin and a lot of the people are 70 80 years old that have seen every game of their life how how are they going to see it they got to stream it well you get this big Corporation and they do a horrible job I mean it's horri and it costs $20 to stream it and there's one camera they literally film it on a computer with one camera that moves down the and I the way I like to take on something it's not to complain about it and this is again how did Letterman take on GE he sent him a fruit basket and it's the funniest thing you ever saw and this was my fruit basket to Spectrum and it was sort of the thing that I just didn't know how people were taking me because there is no comedy in maslim football you know it's been around for 125 years and I don't think anyone brought comedy and I knew that eventually it would be and now people are saying me what are the skits GNA be next year and and it's basically we do like a cold open is the idea and it's not you know I try to think what is the town talking about and how are we going to say what we need to say but not be mean about it be funny about it uh it's fantastic and and somewhere in there I I I threw in that that like I watched that video probably four times the first day you sent it to me it's just it you know I'm from British Columbia Canada it's it it's it totally translates over it's fantastic um yeah and and I just I I love that you're bringing your brand of personality to this that's how you can contribute and you talk about how can these local you know these local people all banned together to make this a thing and unfortunately they put the pressure on these 15 17 to 17 year olds but everybody gets involved everybody's invested everybody brings what they can to the table and what you bring to the table is something very unique I love that you got to experience this uh a at the time so they gave you okay so last year they then they put you in charge of the whole thing and that's the year they could win the whole thing but you had something to do with this it it I mean there are no coincidences in Life as we know I mean come on no one put put me in charge I took it let's say I just slowly just slowly started um but like last year I did a thing where I would ask these kids what is your hype song that you listen to before you play and then I had to listen to them and review them the next week now of course they were all rap songs they were all horrible songs that I can't quote one thing from or I'll get in trouble because it even though we're not through the school technically because it's me who's doing all this sure I you know I gotta I gotta play so I can't really say things but the next week with me reviewing these rap songs was hilarious and I learned all about L Wayne and all these things that were just and these kids are just looking at me and I it was so much fun because that's what you want you want them to take me seriously um and that's when the show works the best when they don't know what's coming at me they just think oh this is probably going to be a sports announcer that's going to ask about passing I don't know I don't know anything about that look at how horrible my cup is oh the dishwasher is really okay yeah there it is it's well used yeah and my hat someone need to go back to hellodd deli.com oh look at oh yeah well well hold on it's now well worn well worn this was my backup hat that's the thing this was my backup one I started wearing my backup one yeah it's funny uh you and I think very very similarly before rert and I connected uh I had a backup Late Show shirt I had the long sleeve tea and I have and I had the second long sleeve tea the the first long sleeve tea was the one I got the first time I saw him in ' 04 whatever it was but then it started getting the little holes in it and stuff and so the last time April of 2015 I got the second longsleeve tea and that's sitting there pristine because I'm GNA wait tell the first long sleeve tea is unwearable before I even start the second one right and then I should have done that with my hat well then I well we are connected you know we know a guy uh hello know a guy hello.com by the way the only sponsor of the Letterman podcast to date uh he may not own the deli anymore but hellodd deli.com curated by our boy rert G is still alive and well um that was something that that I probably hadn't even it didn't make last days of Letterman but I don't know how public it is when Dave left he gave rert the uh the the the the merchandise rights for Late Show with David Letterman and he said you can have that for as long as you want them and I I just again people talk about how generous Dave is uh we just had for our anniversary show the the gal who won the Marquee and um and she talked about it she talked like everybody talks about how generous Dave is that was such a cool thing that he did for rert So for anybody who wants to replace their mug their hat their shirts go to hellodd deli.com and um you know if you ask real nicely I'm sure he'll add onions to your order send it on to R say hi to him so there you go I don't know if if if you really want onions in that so okay now let's get to what we're here for okay yes yes let's talk about we got we got the 90s book which we got to get to we're gonna get to that for that'll make it tax deductible but and I have a little I have a little uh I have a little addition to that I have a little addition for the90s we'll get to that though we got to talk to whenever something big happens in late night in the genre of late night uh Scott and I will exchange a text we'll exchange a call we'll do something we're we're we're two of those guys who will discuss things and we haven't done it yet so please right so I gotta I gotta set it up just a little bit where I am please do watching is this coming through I mean Larry I'm watching Larry Sanders right now and I'm in season three and it is bringing me back to sort of what you were talking about anyway like how much late night meant to me back then I mean it is interesting that we talked about the final six weeks and of course I loved the final six weeks but I wasn't consumed with late night during the final six weeks I was just watching Dave I don't I couldn't even tell you if I mean this is the honest gness truth I don't even know if Leno was still on when Dave went off and I don't want to know he was he was not a thought in my mind I couldn't tell you who was after Dave or after anyone I was watching no one but Dave but when you go back to the Larry Sanders everything was oh my gosh you were I was watching Tom Snider and I loved that and my whole life was late night you know reading everything Bill Carter published y um there was a guy called Matt Rush In The USA Today yep he used to cover late night and you know you would just read all of that yep and I loved that time that's that is my favorite time of Television is being excited about that absolutely and I feel none of that now and I mean I I mean I guess it's nice that they did the Strike Force Five yeah on and they're all best buddies and it's and you come on my show I'll come on your show but I don't want to be a part of it I like when Dave would just Ripple and and it was so much fun and you know what I mean like it was just fun it was fun but it doesn't exist anymore and I don't even care what goes on in late night y but I love Conan I do love Conan Y and I will say that if I could do any book in the world it would be on Conan like I want to do a book on Conan so badly but I just feel like I can't so that's why I'm not I mean I think because he has so many podcasts and because he's told his story so much and they have that inside cone in y I just feel like if I did a book I would just listen to their podcast and I would write it down and I would put it in a book and I don't feel like I would really be doing something you know what I mean yeah I do I I know yeah like what I did in the last six weeks no one thought of no one cared but me I didn't know you cared as well we didn't know each other that but like I was so curious about that and I just feel like unless I could get Conan to like let me move in with him and do like you know 20 30 interviews then that would be a thing but I don't think Conan wants to does he watch your show did we know uh I don't know if Conan watches this I know that one of his best friends does okay well I mean you know if they want someone who loves late night to tell the Conan O'Brien story I would love to anyway I always keep an eye on Conan so I saw that he was on The Tonight Show for the first time uh since he left with Jimmy Fallon he was going to be on and I never watched Jimmy Fallon you know bless his little heart I didn't watch him when he did anything ever you know I don't he's just not my I'm not Fallon is not for me he wasn't I was never we weren't the right ages yeah so but I'm like I'm gonna tune in to The Tonight Show because I love Conan and it's cool that he's come back so the first thing that just burns me and I'm like here's where I can be that old guy that's like kids you don't understand I you got your YouTube bless your hearts I'm so glad you got your YouTube but they start the clip with Conan at the chair and the first thing Jimmy Fallon says is what an ovation I didn't see the Ovation why are you cutting out they don't show on YouTube they didn't show the Ovation yeah no you're right they didn't they didn't no no I DVR it want to see Conan come out I don't have cable anymore what am I for what would I have cable for I don't have a DVR I don't have there's nothing onk as publicized you don't have a DVR as publicized very well in last days of Letterman it's when the first paragraph or two paragraphs it talks about how you don't have a DVR anymore yeah there was no reason for me to have cable once there was there was no Dave like why would you but what a world we live in yeah that they don't Co Conan walking through the curtain is what I wanted to see and they don't show it to me what what is your opinion of how this is our first topic we've got we Haven you and I haven't talked about this at all we we no he do I'm just totally taking the show save it for the show like we were gonna start doing what we do and I'm like no no no save it for the show um what what is your opinion question this okay go ahead it's a question because I wonder if there because the song he came out to was the Late Night with Conan O'Brien theme including the lead singer of The Roots doing the announcing job doing the Andy RoR job you know and you know he included and and with Andy RoR and the ma Max Weinberg 7 and now Conan O'Brien he's saying these words kind of like the way that that that he would say it but it's the roots playing Conan's which theme was it was it the it was late night because he even said it's late night with Conan O'Brien okay and and and he he did the the the same um you know the same uh dialogue that would have been done during an episode of of of of late night and it was it was that theme and I wonder now is there a rights issue of some sort with that song and that's why YouTube didn't play it a a rights issue NBC would own it so what's the difference or Conan would own it so what's the difference and also who cares AG have them well but I mean to me it's a bigger thing like yeah you're right I suppose I could pay for peacock and then I could watch it I call it Pak it's funny to call it Pak but but this is why so late night is shrinking and shrinking so they're like well let's spend less money let's clip it up but you're losing why we watched Dave it was for when they come out what song is Paul gonna play and all of these kind of things it was everything and when you remove all of those things what these Bon head Network Executives don't realize is you're killing the very thing that you don't understand why it's dying yeah yes exactly throw another commercial in there so I'd have to watch another reverse mortgage from Tom celic it's fine I wanted to see Conan walk through and I didn't so first of all tell me about it what kind of Ovation was it how did you feel seeing Conan come through there was it emtional CU I didn't see it it's funny too because uh they actually they actually refer to this a little bit uh to me everything about that was Conan looked gigantic he looked like a giant and I'm not just saying a physical giant although he did look like a physical giant when Conan came out I'm like holy he's trans he's transcended you know there was a point where Dave became so giant he was bigger than every guest he sat beside or whatever uh Conan has transcended to that level and he looked that way when he walked out it was like wow um and he looked gigantic physically compared to everything including the set and you saw it when he got up and he you know Conan's very physical and he gets up and does his little gangly walk in front of the set he looked bigger than the set like the set looked so small and I think um you know with Dave in the theater uh your backdrop uh there Conan's Tonight Show and Conan's TBS show were shot where it looked bigger it just did and I think it suited his physical presence uh there was a point where where where Jimmy Fallon actually gets up on his desk like during the standing ovation which is Ruckus to say the least uh uh Jimmy gets up on his desk and is clapping for Conan and Conan's sitting in the chair already he does this like he's looking up Jimmy's skirt it was a funny little piece of business that he did um but it was it was a gigantic um Ovation and they were playing Conan's original theme which I was I was like Wow and so why wouldn't you put that up because no one including the networks they don't care about TV anymore like I mean honestly were pushing Dave for that you know you and I have talked about that bit where they were forcing Dave to tweet yep and things and and that was when I started to think like man I just think that was before he announced he was gonna leave and you know I used to ask people that question when I was doing the interviews and I could never really get someone to go on the record to say yeah that's kind of when Dave knew he was done but um you wanted to push everyone to these little moments and then you're too dumb to know that's what we wanted to see absolutely absolutely that's the only reason why I could think they didn't put up is is is a rights thing there's a be there's no rights they could pay for it I agree yeah and so they should have because the Ovation was enough that you're like whoa this is a big moment like it felt like a big moment um not as big by the way and I we can get to this in a well we can get to it now I guess I I I I compared it immediately was compar comparing it like from the monologue on I was comparing it to when Dave showed up on Co bear a few months ago right and and and and just seeing what kind of treatment they would give Conan versus the treatment that they gave Dave and and to me I noticed it almost immediately um that they didn't make it as big of a deal when they could have you know with Dave they the entire show was dedicated to him including when the national uh who who is one of Dave's favorite bands you know Dave's there introducing them and he it's one of Dave's favorite bands who's the musical guest that night like right I mean to me that was such a beautiful beautiful tribute The Tonight Show had the opportunity to do something identical to that I mean Conan's podcast is one of the most popular podcasts in the world there's a there's a not just a television his broadcast history um you know historical uh uh reason to do it but also it makes sense to do it Con one of the biggest uh personalities on the planet you could have devoted the entire show to him the way that they did with Dave and they didn't which I thought was very very interesting and I mean it like it it gets us back to do we as Pop Culture moments is it a bigger deal for Conan to go to The Tonight Show or for Conan to go to Seth to go to late night I mean that's where we really know Conan because NBC didn't really care about what they did on The Tonight Show anyway I think they're equal because uh Fallon and they didn't go over this but Fallon was Conan's successor right Fallon took over for late night after like you know so so so you got your family tree there you got Dave Conan Fallon and then Seth you know Seth hosts late night and there's you know by by name it's the same show and they do a couple little things but I believe that Conan tried to keep late night it was his own but he tried to keep it with a very similar uh disposition than what than what Dave had like late night was also a type of show and I think Conan tried to to do a good job of through his own way make it the same thing uh Jimmy I would say also did the same thing because he had lots of things other than just talk moments desk traditional talk show stuff whereas Seth I don't think does that so I do see Jimmy being a guy where you could create one of these gigantic pop culture moments but you're exactly right certainly Conan going back to late night uh would do the same thing as well and I think I I hope he does I hope because I I like the idea of Seth and Conan having a having a dialogue that appeals to me a little bit more than the idea of of of Jimmy and Conan having a dialogue I don't know if you noticed but Conan kind of ran that interview well I but I yes I noce but also I don't think that Jimmy is capable of of that and it's an interesting it's an interesting piece to look at did Jay Leno will it be will The Tonight Show always be Jay lenos and not Johnny Carson's because if Jimmy Fallon is what they want and Jimmy Fallon is successful Jimmy Fallon is the perfect successor to jaylena that is a great point where Conan is such the successor to Letterman to Dave yeah you know to me Conan and let's look at what Conan started with you'll never be as good as Letterman I mean he even knew it his first thing he came on and I remember watching it I watched Conan's first Show Oh yeah and when he did that you'll never be as good as Letterman I remember sitting back because this is how I watch Comedy and I went huh yeah yeah I would have done that too that's a good idea that's how you do it you don't ignore it you lean right into it Y and you know that I mean Jay Leno famously didn't even mention Carson I know just took the Tonight Show and said who the Johnny Carson do we say I don't like to swear on things I I know we can but but uh well sometimes we should damn it we should when it comes to Lena and what he did to The Tonight Show so that's a y now here's B here's B what I texted Mike God bless him he's like a um he's like a doctor that I used to have at a mental patient and when I get in trouble you know I could text my doctor and he's like come in we'll have a session that's how I feel about late night and ponin says one sentence in the middle of a story and I just reacted and I was just like ah I have to talk about this now do you do you have an idea of what my sentence is I've got a few things written down I want to know what I I I want I want to react to it cold here I don't want to predict it I want to react to it those of you at home if you want to have fun pause this and watch Conan's second appearance on YouTube because they they got to split it into two oh get more commercials but don't pay don't pay for the big moment when he comes out watch the second thing it happens in the second thing then come back and see what Mike and Scott are talking about also be sure you get a life so Conan tells a story about Prince and it's a really good story yep and in it he is the the bit of the story is that Prince is at a Stevie Wonder tribute thing for some charity the benefit that the culmination of the evening yep and the surpris is Prince is going to come out and play the guitar to uh Superstitious by Stevie Wonder and Conan is backstage with him and Conan is telling the story and as Prince he stands up and Conan does this and then he looks to the roots and says I'll teach it to you I'll teach it to you guys and then he says Jesus and sits down that is the greatest moment of late night television in years in years and years I know Letterman was on Co bear and you want to say that's the greatest moment no because he's he's being nice to co bear they're all being nice everyone is playing can you imagine Martin Short on Dave and Martin Short is GNA stand up and do a Frank sinat thing and he says I did it or New York New York would be better you know he says Start Spreading the News and Paul and the band they do nothing yep you gotta be kidding me immediately Paul is BU and the first thing I thought is a you know con is flabbergasted and it's like Conan guess what the roots haven't listened to a Jimmy Fallon interview in 20 years and neither have we no nobody's listening that's that's what they just said there nobody's listening because nothing is being said and there's Conan working as ass off and they didn't know to play yep yep and I just thought this like if I was writing a book about late night today that would be my opener nobody's listening and so moments aren't happening and networks executives are scratching their head why why are why isn't as popular we don't get it and it's because you're cutting out what matters you're making everything safe when why we love Dave was everything was dangerous and Conan was dangerous I would submit his stories were dangerous he was up he was down he was not just sitting there yeah yeah definitely unpredictable uh unpredictable as well like that it wasn't it wasn't cookie cutter it wasn't cookie cutter at all and right now it feels very cookie cutter very formulaic uh connect the dots the same Dot every single night and and and and and this is one of those times where you have the ability to break the mold because you actually have a moment that and Ian we're still talking about it but yes I I wrote it I wrote it down that was one of my favorite parts of the whole bur I'll teach it to you guys that's what he said that was the quote Yeah I mean and the roots are amazing I'm not attacking the RO they are an incredible it's not them it's the show it's the industry where again like you're saying someone might have said oh how much do we have to pay Stevie Wonder If we play that you know like oh my gosh we don't and you think of Dave saying I want to hear an eagle song yeah and you know it derails the whole show yep um but even if you didn't play the exact Superstition and you're allowed to play five notes yeah but you could do a slap slap because everyone knows the beginning of superstition like the moment Conan starts saying it you're like oh yeah that that you know that part and you could easily easily yes I mean I I I mean I I think it's one I think it's as good of a burn as when Jimmy Kimmel said to Leno you know and Leno said did you ever pull a practical joke and he said yeah one time I gave someone a talk show for 10 10 weeks and then pulled it back or whatever you know for him to say that and then what was funny is that my at the end Conan really says nice things to Jimmy Fallon because he's a professional and my wife came through and she said oh like that's kind of over the top or whatever like is does he really feel that about Jimmy Fallon and I said Conan's a professional he's not gonna come back there and not be professional he what we got was a glimmer of the truth when he said because you you can see it in his eyes he can't believe he was left alone out there yeah absolutely as a comic you want you want someone to have your back and bounce this way and bounce that way all right doctor give me give me my S give me my pills what are we going to do about this I mean how did you feel about it am I just crazy no I wrote it down I I it was I laughed out loud I went I I did a like I did one of those when when he did that I noticed it too um it was it was it was obvious but again I go back to the cookie cutter thing of the of of of I loved I don't know if you watched uh I guess it's about a year ago now holy smokes no not quite a year because Paul was on for our one-year anniversary and I and I talked to Paul about this so it's not quite a year when um The Roots went to the Grammys I think and oh maybe it was a year yeah I guess it was just over a year ago the roots went to the Grammys and they brought in Paul and the world's most dangerous band right there by the way watch to to The Tonight Show and and I thought they changed I thought they changed the tone of the show in a lot of ways and it wasn't just because they played so many old Letterman standards or late show standards um I think it was because they got them a little bit more involved they get the roots involved all the time but they do it in a cookie cutter way like like again to compare the two shows um when I went and saw Dave a month before he retired I went and saw The Tonight Show the next night and I remember one of the comparisons that I made was watching Letterman again in April of of 2015 it's a concert it's a rock concert in there and and and they play through the commercial breaks like it's real time there are no bumpers it doesn't work that way they don't do the bumpers um and the next night when I went to uh The Tonight Show I was super stoked kind of expecting this because I like the roots too I think there huge energy they've got their own unique energy but I'm watching um as uh Brian graser was one of the guests and and and um you know they're playing they're playing out and they're starting a song and then okay we're out silence so it's like eight bars of a song and then okay five this could have been the Tonight Show right you're saying The Tonight Show but that was Fallon tonight or uh sorry it was a late night it would have been late night I'm sorry I'm sorry it was late night it was I mean I don't want to tell the thank you for that thank you for that but I was trying to figure out like what he flew to La it was The Tonight Show Len retired first it was the tonight's show Lena retired first right I don't know I said I didn't care and I don't care but I just don't understand 2010 no sorry it was T holy you had me you had me thinking there for a second no cuz um my second favorite Letterman run uh was 2010 when Leno lost the gave away The Tonight Show whatever then he came back right the the whole late shift 2 happened in 2010 Leno comes back and then Leno leaves again and gives the show to Jimmy Fallon and and and that happened um that happened before Dave retired so yeah because Letterman outlasted Leno and so it was The Tonight Show so we went to the tonight and it was yeah I remember I've got a picture of Nico there so I who man you had me you I'm sorry because I could I I I at least I was honest at front and I said I didn't care at that point I just didn't it it it ended for you our best friend on TV left um but no and and so I was really surprised that you know okay we're back in five 4 3 2 and now they're playing a different seven bars of the same song to bring it back whereas across the street still across the street at the Ed Sullivan Theater every night Paul and the band are playing through entire songs throughout the commercial break they're running it differently it was just it had a different energy to it in how it was run and and I think that you know the band getting involved in doing things uh that was a huge missed opportunity you're you're bang on right I noticed it as well um yeah and it was neat to see Conan out call it out and I felt like you got a piece of Conan and the other thing is if you're a comedian this is a argument I have with people all the time and it's that comedians are not mean this is where people I I just don't believe that they're funny and but you have him he's as raw as he can be in that moment he's he's totally there so he's going to say what he's thinking in his mind he wasn't think thinking I want to to dice up Jimmy Fallon and leave him on the floor no that's not what he's doing he's just reacting because he's you know a comic genius um I mean did you see him on the hot wings Che oh God that was so good and I'm really glad that they talked about the moment where he would go when he was writing SNL sketches he would sneak down into Letterman's Studio yeah go behind Dave's desk and write sketches for SNL like I I love that I had heard that before but I hadn't heard it been talked about in a long time so it was really cool that was one that was one of the questions you want to talk about a guy who commits to a bit and by the way when he did that with the roots he it was it was an improv thing where someone could say yes a because when he said I'll teach it to you Jimmy could have done something they could have Quest could have said something they could have they could have turned that into a moment and con was opening door way I know I'm interrupting you but let's do it this way let's say let's go back to my Frank Sinatra Paul Paul schaer thing let's say Martin Schwarz says that and Paul doesn't play Dave would have said whoa whoa whoa Paul you taking the night off yeah what do we still have a band yep I don't know Doc is here Doc is not here and they would have done it and then it would have probably been a thing all night exactly yes and it would have been great like it wasn't that Conan was trying to destroy him he just and you can see it in his face I rewatched it before we did did this cuz I just wanted to take and there's a flash where Conan just can't believe and you know you and I both think of ourselves as comedians first even though no one's told us that no we have no data to back it up no but you do feel like you're out there alone when you're doing it but you also know that if you if you stop to consider what you're going to say and I'm not saying that you're being consider it but if you start running it through the Twitter social media Justice police you're dead you just got to go what's coming out of your mouth you know the skit that that you talked about was Spectrum that's a complete improv for me I set up two cameras and I did it like four times in a row I didn't know nothing was written I didn't know that voice I didn't know anything but you have to be like okay I'm gonna make a complete jackass of myself and I don't care yep that is what you're seeing on Conan's face he just can't believe that someone isn't there to help him y yep did we beat this I feel like this horse is dead but no it's good though it's it's it's really good good now let's jump over to let's go to hot ones for a second you want to talk about a guy committing to the bit uh like I mean like and I I put the I put the joke up on uh the Letterman podcast I will sometimes be the one that comments on behalf of the Letterman podcast on other people's YouTube channels and uh and and my comment on on the hot one's episode from the Letterman podcast was um uh stay tuned for Conan's new podcast Conan O'Brien needs a bowel because having that drinking those last two I know and and you see like everybody there is in shock because Conan and for those who haven't watched it yet go watch it by the way you have to watch it it's fantastic it's the co I mean again I am this is how books come to me and it's so funny like I'm just all I've been doing is thinking about comedy and Conan and it's just rolling in me and I don't know how what what's going to come out I feel like I wanted to talk to you but I can tell it's not enough like I want to study what Conan has done yeah because it's incredible yep and like I love how Martin Short committed you think of Bill Murray committing when he jumped in the um the the um dumpster and got hurt remember that on Letterman absolutely you know Bill Murray was someone who committed whatever bit he worked up it didn't matter what was going to happen he was 100% y but nothing I've never seen anything like what Conan did no and and and uh like nobody does that like I mean I I've watched quite a few hot ones like whenever somebody of note that I enjoy goes on that show I watch it and and and the reverence they have for those kind of those last two is just it's it's it's nuts and and like Conan brought he did what like Andy calman would do when he would be on Letterman or Steve Martin you know it's like he planned for it for weeks brought an actor with him brought who is his doctor right you know so we've got a little shtick there we've got you know and and he brought so much to it to make it amazing but none of the the the trimmings that he brought uh came close to to to to coming close to what what what he did what he brought to it and and um well probably the greatest tweet that I saw about it said Conan just ruined hot ones forever yep it shouldn't exist anymore and I'm like it's true like yeah I I'm real sorry but your show is over like would you I mean I think they did say first of all they said it was season 23 and I thought oh I just I'm so old like I never had seen the show before I'd heard about it but you know I just it did appeal to me but I knew Conan would be great and I do follow him he made me watch Jimmy Fallon he made me watch Hot ones you know I'm I'm just the travel show is gonna be great too by the way oh yeah I'm just hoping Conan doesn't go on Alex Jones Show or else I'm gonna have to watch that you know I've been talking about to Conan to a lot of people um over the last week or whatever I love I by the way I love being this guy and I think you can probably um I in fact I know that you can relate if something Twin Peaks happens if something Letterman happens if something whatever whatever the worlds that you have gone deep into whenever something happens within those worlds people many of whom are attached to those worlds will reach out to you to shoot the about it and and and I adore being like becoming that guy through these last two years so incredible well and you're one of the guys that I love doing this with and and there's a few people who who who do that so I've been talking about Conan a lot over the last couple weeks with folks and and and the comparisons and all of these things um and and it's interesting to me that you've got these two gigantic Personalities in David Letterman and Conan O'Brian with their unique voices and unique uh perspectives and unique bodies of work both of whom really put it into hyperdrive after a dysfunctional way of not getting the Tonight Show and and in in in in that because I mean you know Leno Fallon they kind of got it in conventional ways and they're doing conventional shows but who are we talking about who are many of us talking about we're talking about some of these guys who didn't get it and they were forced to go out and kind of make their own history and in making their own history they did it in a unique way he he talked about it on the on on there he said he said something in one of those shows I don't I forget which one it was but he said yeah during the Turner years and he talked about the Turner years like that's how he referred to that part of his career I loved his Turner show I thought it was fantastic it was it was really really great um and and again both of these guys forced to go out and make these unique histories that nobody could ever ever copy and and not that it's easy to get The Tonight Show or or one of these other shows but but if you're you know you you go along Kimmel's doing the same thing Kimmel's Kimmel's history is also extremely um you know it's Unique as well and and and I think that there's something to be said for that that you know you look at par pars was like that um you know Johnny of course was like that and and and uh um The Tonight Show they're trying to keep it as I'm going on The Tonight Show and NBC is always going to try and be that I'm going to go on The Tonight Show but the guys that you and I like I'm that guy are this guy's going on Conan this guy's going on Letterman this guy's going on you know whatever um because it's the guy rather than the institution that we love so much what do you see as the common denominator between Conan and Dave let's I don't want to compare in contrast but let's just compare you know what what what are the VIN diagram pretend that I knew words um to for you what do you see let's say lipus test because we don't really know what it means but it sounds right but it sounds good but I don't it's too close to lips and I feel like that gets moist then we get a bunch of words we don't want to talk about yeah nobody likes that I'll tell you this if I was 9 years old I remember watching Letterman kind of for the first time when I was nine and I remember this is what I would say if I were nine years old and I watched Conan O'Brien for the first time I would say the same thing I can't believe okay so wait hold on adults get to act silly like this how can I because I I want that yeah I want that when I'm an adult I want to be able to to act silly that right there I think is a common denominator right there there's a zany silly whatever you want to call it you know people would would use the smart word with Dave irreverent um I think that I think that is probably the uh I think the tone is different in the silly zany but yeah to me off the top of my head as you ask that question what is it for you I think it's that they are secretly so Ed at I think when you think about Dave sure he's funny of course but when he had a scientist on to talk about solar energy y or he had a politician on and I know he' always said I'm just a dumb guy and that's what he's doing and Conan does the same thing but they're secretly so smart yeah and then and I say secretly because they really do a good job hiding it and and someone passing through the room could could just say oh they're silly they're they're that's stupid yeah you know so much especially of Conan and certainly of Dave's early show you could just say well that's stupid except it isn't stupid and there's so much thought and I also think they're really kind people yes and that it makes all the difference like because attached right and I find it really fascinating that in our time they're going to be the two greatest you know without a doubt the the other ones are nobody's I mean bless them but they no there are some 14 15 year olds where the current crop are there you know it's watching well way I don't believe you I don't know you find me a 14-year-old that's like I can't wait to see see Steven colar take his glasses off and put sunglasses on to be Joe Biden you think there's a 14-year-old that's waiting up for that I think that one of the Timeless things in life is that there are still teenagers who are not getting laid and uh they watch late night TV I think that is a Timeless thing the other thing about Dave and conen is that they're both curious um one thing that Dave constantly talks about is is is at the end uh of his run one of the things he loved doing and this is where I think I might I might get a chance to actually you know talk with him because I I I think he loved talking to the folks in the to the folks in the audience he loved he said that was his favorite part of the show was talking to just just people Conan I think calls it the you know getting out in the world and talking to people of the world I think is how he refers to it but like what is Conan's show based on it's based on him going out in the world and the reactions from people and the genuine conversations that he can have with people I adore the fact that he has con O'Brien needs a fan and it's not just it's not just a celebr but he's got regular folk who he can just be curious towards and yeah of course he pulls comedy out of everything just like Dave does you know he relies on the razor sharp wit so I think that's another comparison of the two they're both naturally curious you went into it how the kind they're not detached when they when they I'll tell you this talking to this family uh who won the Marquee I don't know if you know the story about the family who won the Marquee yet you saw the video uh on YouTube go watch the video it's really really good on the official YouTube channel um I had the gal and her uncle on it hasn't aired yet but Dave they they they they warned them and said Dave's coming in for 15 minutes and that's it well he stayed 90 minutes and and and every single one of them felt seen and heard and felt like a million damn dollars at the end and and all the while throughout the video they cut it together so beautifully you know Dave everyone we love making people's dreams come true they said it probably six times seven times in the video and they're saying it's sarcastically as whatever and I asked them about that and they said well yeah that might have been tongue and cheek but no this guy he loves making people's dreams come true like they were like they he he blew us away and I think that that is something that is really cool a cool connection between Conan and Letterman I think they both enjoy doing that at this point in their careers yeah I I agree and I don't know I'm gonna still think about this book idea because I feel like it there's so much to Conan and I would just I would love Conan needs a book maybe I don't know we'll see uh I would love it because I I one thing I appreciate about you so much is your sensibility towards things your perspective you it's rare these days when somebody can take a subject that has been uh explored in so many ways and come in with a perspective out a left field you do it with Twin Peaks you do it the way that you um compare uh Cinema your new book is that and one of the things I love about your new book is is the the the subject of it all of these people who were involved with these projects were sitting on panel with all the shows that you and I loved Conan let remember growing up um I love that let's talk about the new book and uh I want I want to give you I I put a little bit of visual art let's talk about this the last decade of Cinema and here's the thing I don't know what was wrong with me this book is so long okay when it came I was like what I this really is the first book I've done done that I couldn't stop writing it and it's got like you know we've got this showing up no nothing's gonna show we've got Laura D this is Laura D yeah citizen Ruth I'm not getting it uh but we've got like it's pictures it matter but I really this you know most of my books are interview based uh because I that's what I like to do I like to get you know you just don't want to here some guy yabing his mouth off but this is me yabing my mouth off about how I feel the '90s were the last time that movies were taking risks basically is my idea and making it for grown-ups and they were hard and you're uncomfortable uh one of the movies I talk about is the ice storm and when you watch that movie you squirm like it's a horror movie and it's it's such a movie about marriage and um I miss that I miss being uncomfortable here we are day fans you know so many people couldn't stand to watch Letterman because those interviews were uncomfortable and I came alive every time it happened yep so what was the Genesis of this because I know you're you know you're you're um one of the foremost officient AOS of Twin Peaks I know that spills over to David Lynch and things like that so we're talking the same similar time period here that was something that you into right yeah my last two books were about 90 David Lynch movies so I guess I'm stuck and there is no David Lynch in this book so I did not cover any Lynch movies because I was like look I got I I don't want to just be the Lynch guy yep um so there is not any of that but what basically I was just looking for a movie to watch one night and I'm just going through you know that horrible thing we used to flip channels and now we scroll over you know these stupid categories that we did at the Blockbuster 2o by the way or the video store the local video store well then it was great when you could walk around and you could hold it but now you're just going and then they have to play a scene from the movie and ruin it for you right away all of it's horrible yeah yeah yeah and I just I saw the movie Awakenings was string and I was like I haven't seen Awakenings maybe since it came out I I'm gonna watch Awakenings that's directed by Penny Marshall Stars Robin Williams and and Robert dairo y the movie blew me away I mean I had it was never a movie I owned it wasn't a movie that I I don't think I had seen it since it came out when it was over I was like what year was that movie made and it happened to be 1990 and it didn't feel old it didn't look old I had recently just watched some early 80s movies and they were good but they kind of felt old yeah and I for every Friday I just watched a movie from the 90s and the more that I was doing it I there were just things that were leaping out to me and I and it became this book I ended up watching 160 movies from the 90s and I cover 55 in the book 55 movies so there's there's 24 Main essays and then the rest are like shorter just because I wanted you you know there's just so many movies I mentione type type type things you know I tried to pick two or three a year go through a long oh okay is that how you did it does you took the entire decade and went two or three a year kind of a thing to yes yes so there's always two and sometimes there's three and then there's interviews I got to interview Patricia arette about True Romance I interviewed Alexander Payne who directed citizen Ruth he recently just was up for Oscars for The holdovers he was working on the holdovers while I was interviewing which was crazy I interviewed Tiger Williams who wrote menace to society and for me the centerpiece of this book is Reality Bites uh came out in 1994 and I interviewed Helen childis who wrote and you know you're not supposed to say something's your best I think it's my best interview ever um we really hit it off and I think if you're a Gen X or you know Reality Bites meant a lot to to you that might be the one of if one of the definitive if Breakfast Club was the generation before reality btes might have been the generation after kind of a thing like the 90s one if the 80s one yeah reality btes was right is might be the one and she doesn't know that so I had to she thinks that movie is a failure and no one ever saw and that interview and those are the interviews I love to do where you're making someone see you know um it it meant everything to me and then so Reality Bites is sort of this the centerpiece but also 1994 you've got Pulp Fiction sha Shank Redemption and Reality Bites I picked 94 as maybe the best year of movies ever and I could have picked so many other from 94 um so if you're it's a very Gen X book is and I didn't know that it was going to be but of course we were in our 20s then and they were making movies and and art really affects you um I do quote Janine grao from her Letterman appearance I watched a lot of Letterman appearances from people a lot of Cisco and eert uh while I was working on it and um I really give a lot of myself in a way it's almost like you're gonna like I talk about the movie but then I also tell little stories about going to the video store I worked at a video store during this time and um so I do go on tangents and I kind of think it's funny too like it has my sensibility we're out of nowhere yeah there becomes a joke and then right into why the directing is incredible and things like that so well that's that's you and I'm I'm I'm so grateful that your personality uh like every time your personality shines through one of your one of your projects it's it's it's a good thing because again you have this fresh perspective you're also uh funnier than uh you're just so so uh funny and you come up with these uh fresh perspectives on things I appreciate that about you very very much I want to ask a question so talking about the like it's funny how I don't know if you have any of these in your life I've got a few of them because again I've got an office upstairs that is full of I'm a collector I collect things right like I just and so um I've got Millennials and and some geners who actually dig me like I say this to my wife um I'm I'm you know a are you sure that they dig you well that's you might have lost them that's how you get the Boomers the Boomers can dig you yeah I'm not sure the Gen zers dig you no they call me fire but I don't understand what that means so they might say you slap yeah that's right but I don't think they're saying hey I dig that guy I also dig rock and roll music and I liked continue um they used to say lit but they don't say lit anymore that's gone now and it's Dam because I just learned the word to to a very small person I say this to my wife because sometimes I'll get stopped for a t-shirt I'm wearing or something like that and and and and I just do this and she's like what does that mean for a teeny tiny slice of people I'm cool as all get out and and um I I try and explain for so these people when they ask me questions about like growing up in the 90s because they worship the 90s they all wish they were from the 90s and and and uh I would that's one thing that I constantly tell them about like you don't understand music store and Video Store culture especially if it was Independence Blockbuster you got it a little bit especially if you had cool people working for the Blockbuster but it was more of the independent video story back then the mom and pop shops that before the uh all the uh like well you said what's what's happening to small town America right now where all the corporations are taking over um going to the video store on a Friday night or you know really nerding out going to the video store on a Tuesday on new release day um you know or a music store and you just go there but I would go there on the Friday night because it's the beginning of the weekend and it was kind of the first stop on the social circuit you go there and you're chilling out and you always see people that you know and you're scrolling through the titles the same way that we do now digitally except it's a communal experience and then you got the last stop you the clerk the person that was there saying hey yeah and you always knew like wait a second hold on you haven't seen Chasing Amy yet whoa you gotta go did Kevin Smith get represented in this book um Dogma there you go oh my favorite Kevin Smith movie by the way yeah my rule is one per director yeah and if you're picking one 90s movie to me it had to be Dogma I feel like that is the Pinnacle of of his I mean I do love Chasing Amy my personal and I even say my personal favorite is M rats it's not his best there's no way you can say m rats is his best movie but the love I had for M rats is off the charts but I feel like these are not my favorite movies and I do say that up front these are movies that I think are worth a look at now and to me that be that be would be dog yeah I uh yeah so so so having the clerk say that to you you know have you seen Dogma yet or have you seen this have you seen that yeah there's you know what uh Jurassic Park is right there sure but there is you know these Little Gems that are there there's singles go watch singles or or or one of the these other uh these other films and so that was a that was a quintessential cultural um connection of the 90s is is going into a music store or a video store and talking about this stuff and dialoguing and and it feels like your book captures that it does because I was working there and the other thing that I say that's that's so different than streaming and I am anti-st streaming I just want to say like I I don't like it I think it's horrible but when you're in the video store if you and me go to the video store there is an unlimited getting video you you stop and you say I want to get Chasing Amy and I say I want to get dogma and the two of us pitch our movie to each other y it wasn't just that you picked a movie you were pitching it to your friends you were saying no no no no you Dogma I mean Alanis moriset is playing God oh Alanis morette's in it okay yeah and you know you're trying to win someone over yes from that and that is gone because now we're just watching the movie and we're not we're on our phones anyway we're not even paying attention absolutely um but I loved how you had to fight for to get you know when you went with a group and I don't know I I I I think that it's going to speak to people and it's probably G to anger people a little bit which I kind of want because you're going to be like you said we're Chasing Amy yes and there is a bit of that in the book but I do set up the rule that of of course like I'm sorry I can't put every Tarantino movie in there and if you're doing the 90s I got to do Pulp Fiction that was the movie of the 90s there were some of those movies that I just you got to do and rightfully so I do think Pulp Fiction is one of the greatest movies ever and it it had to be in there um do you remember uh uh on Late Show how much Dave talked about pul fiction well well I mean that's everything and everything in 1994 could come down to Letterman hosting the Oscars there you go and stupid ass Forest Gump winning over pul fiction and I will say that Forest Gump and Titanic are not in my book and I say in the front part look I've never seen either of them and I'm never going to I mean I have a thing it says right up front I'm sorry I understand that y'all went crazy for Forest gum but I was over here watching Pulp Fiction and there is and I I've never seen Force Gump we love Tom Hanks great typewriter story on Dave and Letterman also yeah Letterman did a lot of Tom Hanks for Stuff absolutely course but there is no way that Force Gump hasn't aged embarrassingly I don't want to get near Forest scum there's no way you you get your uh gen Z people they're not going to dig for a scump okay they're gonna have a lot of problems with with Forest Gump today not in my book um Titanic as well like is not I mean bless them the ship sinks y'all have a good day these are movies about grown-ups and characters that will make us feel in the smallest way not gallons of water coming down the pike uh that's not what this this book is at all um I wanted to talk about pul fiction for a second because uh you know love the movie adored the movie I was one of the guys that went to video store Superior uh yeah Superior video so Superior video got all their copies of pul fiction this wasn't in a day back when when when movies were accessible you couldn't just buy them I paid $100 for pul fiction I actually wanted one of the that they paid $100 for these movies I'm like get an extra one I will pay you $100 in $1 1994 uh I want that movie and and I I uh that was one of those movies I watched so many times that I I memorized a lot of dialogue and it was also one of those movies where I realized what Quinton Quinton Tarantino he will go for the style rather than the substance in glorious bastards Hitler dies you know he goes for the style of things right and and and the story if it rings through with the story then he does for the actual factual information so jeweles uh I I learned very very quickly you know because I grabbed my I grabbed my uh Bible uh and and and and Ezekiel 25:17 read it and realized that you know he kind of picked and choose chose some of the some of the the passages out of that and then combined a couple things and put them together so I was like okay so that's not the exact passage but but we get the spirit of it and it's badass and it's a cool scene there's one other scene that just this very week I got a chance to verify and I want to share it with you uh I was in France this week and uh I had to the moment like when candy and I went to to to Paris there aren't very many of them comparatively to over here in North America but when I I saw McDonald's I'm like excuse me for a second I've got to go to McDonald's and she's like are you kidding me let's go and let's go and have this culinary delight over here I'm like I'm not going to order anything relax but I had to go and do this and I want to share it with you uh I don't know if you can see this or not I can see a Royale with cheese it's not a Royale with cheese it's a royal cheese it's a Royale or a Royale it's not a Royale with cheese it's a Royale cheese but it doesn't sound as good it just doesn't sound as good as it did uh and they might have dropped the wi since 1994 they may have they they they may have and I'm open to that but it wouldn't have been with it would have been Royale a cheese and and and so I'm not certain that is the case but Royale with cheese has sounds way better than Royale cheese so anyway so I pick a quote from each movie okay chapter and for pul fiction I wanted it it actually matches my essay but because you said you memorized it I'm curious if you're G to recognize this quote because I went a little deep cut for it okay ain't quite time yet come on let's hang back yep when they're in the apartment and then they started talking about foot massages it was in the middle of the foot massage uh section yeah yep that is my quote from Pulp Fiction because to me that's the scene that I try to talk about um which is i that's when I became a Quinton Tarantino fan for life was is that scene because I got it sitting in the theater because the camera comes up it's real tight on John and Sam and then he says ain't quite time yet let's hang back but it's one take the camera just moves down the hall and they walk down the hall and they're way down there and they're talking about the foot massage and then I was like that's because this isn't part of this isn't the plot yep you know he's telling you this is but that's the movie and then they come back in and even says let's get into character y yes and you're saying now we're coming back to the mov and this movie is going to be moments of plot inside things that are going to Keep Us Alive and that you know and what I'm lamenting basically is some executive would say well cut that part about the food or the foot massage like I we got to get in you know this is 15 minutes into the movie you got to get him in and where he's killing that guy and can you kill him worse way could he kill everyone right away why is he talking and having a bite of the Big Kahuna Burger yeah and it's like you're missing all those things just like what I was saying about them cutting um Conan's entrance we're just at this place we're settle down we got the time and that's really what the book um laments about I don't spoil movies um especially some of the in the middle of the 90s you know we got such Independent films there are probably some people won't see I always say like look I'm not going to give away this part for sha Shank Redemption I do give away that ending like there's no way yeah and everybody's seen it um but I try to be respectful and um I don't know I'm really proud of it it's it's something that I feel like if you're our age this is going to bring you back to those moments of when movies meant everything to us are there any sequels represented in this book no yeah and right there that is The Telltale sign of what that decade was about when it came to movies uh remakes were almost Unthinkable I mean I could think of a couple I don't even know if the getaway was in the 90s or not actually now that I think about that might have been in the 2000s like I I'm certain that there were some remakes in the 90s but very very very few and far between and a sequel was a big deal compared to when you compare now how many movies uh that that come out movies whatever our I have the statistic in my introduction and I said that I believe it was in 2022 or 2023 all top 10 films were sequels or IPS and in 1994 zero yeah there were the top 10 movies of 1994 are 10 completely original ideas can you imagine that that's insane and there also are no superhero franchises born in the 90s now Batman was 89 and there are Batman sequels throughout the 90s none of them are in my book but no superhero franchise born in the '90s isn't that interesting yeah because X-Men was until the 2000s and Spider-Man which really started it as 2002 yeah um and it just it was so much fun to watch all these movies and think of what I'm going to talk about and and I bring it in to now and how people can see it but I'm also not I'm not judging people I say from the beginning look if some actor was cancelled that's your business we're talking about what they did in the 90s I don't get involved in looking back at the 990s with today's prison like you can't do that no no exactly and I don't think we should do that it's uh it's a fascinating growing pain that we're going through with that right now and uh uh being able to separate people and and art I think is is is something that we need to kind of get back to um not not discounting anything that or anything that anybody has ever gone through don't get me wrong I'm not saying that I I am saying that it's interesting how folks want to equate uh actions with body of work I don't know about you I worked for a lot of jerks growing up and you know they've been around forever why wouldn't they be in those Pursuits as well of course they would be but um any Tom Cruz movies in there uh yes um Magnolia there we go right on so that was the Paul that was the Paul Thomas Anderson movie was the Magnolia that that actually that's that the Magnolia essay kind of ends the book I kind of say that that movie is the culmination of everything from the 90s like literally thrown into that um and that movie means the world to me I love Magnolia I talk about Boogie you know some people may have wanted Boogie Knights but I'm a magnolia person over Boogie Knights um I think Boogie kns might be in the back of the book when I have my I have 30 more films just to kind of cover bases because I knew people would be angry and also I couldn't stop writing the stupid book um but I think that might be Tom Cruz's only movie that's in there oh no eyes wide shut as well oh that's that's your kubric movie is eyes white get yeah it's the 90s so it's got to be your yeah because I don't did you have another did did he have another movie in the 90s I don't think Stan it's unlikely but he could have been the early yeah yeah no oh there you go but no David Lynch movie no I did not I I you know I I done a book on Lost Highway I did a book on firewalk with me I didn't I I just wanted to step away but the other thing is these are not the point of this book is not to find the most artsiest movie yeah my point is every movie that I picked played in the mall these are movies that played everywhere and that was the other thing um you know not every David Lynch movie played everywhere they were still this these are not yeah I mean yeah most of his did not get wide releases but um um I wanted to show that these were popular movies you know the in the my first chapter it's good Fellas and pretty woman yeah and people might be like what you're gonna analyze pretty woman and I would say My Pretty Woman essay is probably the most collegate thing that I wrote because I really wanted to take this movie that is viewed as a complete romcom yep and treat it seriously to show you that even the romcoms do you remember what the subplot is in Pretty Woman well I know all about Pretty Woman how it wasn't even Gary Marshall kind of off the side of his desk turned it into a romcom because it was actually going to be a serious movie about drugs and and and and and there was yeah there was it was not so not so nice stuff and then but what we even saw on the screen you know with uh with Stucky or or with uh uh um Jer and and his behavior and all that stuff so yeah no pretty woman is a fascinating everything about that movie is fascinating how it how it became what it became from where it where it started it's fascinating to me yeah I've actually found the original script which is called 3000 and read it and then I do kind of compare and contrast um what's on the screen and is it is really crazy what Gary Marshall did so um you know there's no video story for you and most of these movies don't even stream because nobody wants to touch a lot of these movies because they're you know like I don't cover train spotting but it was one of the ones that I watched and like there's a scene where someone shoots up while a baby is crawling on the floor and people would lose their head now they would just be like that director says you should give cocaine to a baby it's probably not cocaine it's probably heroin I don't know my drugs I just I I'm just not up on the drugs I know the kids will dig it I mean Millen Millennials dig me I'm I'm gonna think about that for days a few a very small slice I want to be very very very clear I've got a few there's a few Millennial well a lot of the reviews for my book say that preschoolers think it's super Keen so I'm with you oh I just had a really really good question and it went away because you Delight oh it's because I was being a I was being delightful no no no no it's a good thing it's a good it's it's it's it's all good it's something I can ask you uh off book um okay so let's so is this this thing out now I thought it was not out till May it's it's actually it's not out till June but I have the copies so when they buy them from me I ship them now because I always try to reward people for like you know pre-ordering with me so I actually just signed a bunch of copies today and they're going out on Monday and then I don't know when this is airing but I'm going out to LA for a signing at the LA book fair and I want to have copies so I just like hurried it up to get them the book doesn't really come out till June that's when the real push will be uh but I have them now so I'm shipping them now so when are you in LA uh this weekend Friday or Saturday and Sunday at the LA Times book fair so I'm doing a signing for my Moonlighting book and the last decade of Cinema um okay well I was gonna finish with I I I remember my question I'm gonna ask you about this have you watched uh Jonah Hills movie mid90s I haven't I highly recommend it I watch it when you do have time to watch it uh watch it and then I would love to talk to you about it yeah I remember when it was coming out I'm G to write it down yeah um and I wanted to see it because it sounded like it was my jam yeah um portrayed portrayed from kids who grew up in the mid99s very very I like I I I I really really thought they captured a lot of good stuff in that movie I I I respect the hell of Jonah Hill um uh for a variety of reasons but that that movie was it was it was it was really good uh but okay so you mentioned the Moonlighting book I want to talk about that and I you know if I have to cut this we'll cut this part if I have to but but I don't I don't know that we will um I remember talking to you before we recorded anything about the Moonlighting book or anything like that because you've been on he cast and you've been on this show and and I've had you on a few times on things but but when we've talked about the Moonlighting book you talking to Cil shepher Shepard was uh was an amazing thing and some of the other people you got a chance to talk to and and I mean it is a phenomenal book about again a show that is just uh you want to talk influential and all of these things your mood lighting book is incredible and I'm glad that it's gotten so many of the accolades that it has and thank you yeah it's it's it's so good um one of the things that we talked about though with was was was Bruce Willis and you had this you had this horrible thought in your mind because it looked like it was going to happen where he was going to be part of things and whatnot and then it kind of got pulled back and privately you said to me b basically in in in so many words oh my God I really hope it's not what I think it might be I hope he's not sick I hope he's not and and um boy is that book ever is the context of that book different to you now that uh inevitability is is is taking shape and and things are happening Mr Willis or is it uh I mean I think it's almost the opposite okay that I think that I'm lucky that I did these interviews before this news came out because then people would have had a different view but at the time no one knew I suspected it because without exaggeration I mean we might have had 10 in times that Bruce was going to do the interview and it got cancelled and that's when I just thought there's something and I think what was going on was that either him or his people people or someone they wanted him to be a part of it but he doesn't have the mental acuity to communicate and then there was even a time what was going to be through email and there probably isn't even that you know so I just suspect it so people were harsh on Bruce when they needed to be in the book and I think if that news would come out it would be all Bruce was a saint and he never did a wrong thing on the set and now the way the book stands it gives a more balanced between Bruce was you know the funniest person on television in the 80s and was becoming a difficult movie star just like cibil was they were very difficult people and I think my book presents it in a truthful light as true as it could be after it happened 30 years from people's memory but if that news came out no one would have said up PE about Bruce wellis absolutely uh I yeah without a doubt as soon as you started saying that it's like oh yeah of course and and to get that perspective beforehand um well and there's things that we can talk about off camera when it comes to similarities U with that and other other things that I've I've I've seen recently too it's it's it's uh yeah it's really great that you you wrote it at the time that you did and I cannot endorse it enough as well by the way if any of you any of the the viewers or listeners all dozen of you if any of you liked uh Moonlighting uh you got to get this book because I it's so it's set up very similarly to what happened with the show too you're kind of it's it's it's going this way this way this way this way this way you get to the middle of the book in an event and then suddenly everything changes just like at the show itself like it is you masterfully written Scott I just I cannot I cannot endorse everything that you do enough um if people want to buy direct from you and I always uh you know my wife and I we we wrote a book and released it uh I know the difference between if somebody buys my book on Amazon versus if they buy it off me for a variety of reasons right and the number one thing is money well there it is um so so let's let's uh any of the library that's out there um do you have all copies sitting at the home office there or or oh I do believe me and you got Letterman's there too of course okay so if you want to buy a book from Scott and of course you want to because he signs them he signs them he'll endorse them he'll uh he'll listen to and I'm going to tell Tales out of school here the only reason I talk about Shey more than probably almost any Stafford because she's the guy this show wouldn't exist if it wasn't for Shey guess who introduced me to shecky that guy right there guess who had an incredible experience with Shey writing last days of Letterman that guy right there we bonded over shei at the very very very beginning and I love him and he'll never leave our set because you know just well and I gotta say that and not saying anything about anyone else that I interviewed for the Letterman book but I was was trying hard to get a letterman jacket and every person told me oh I got 12 of them and I you know I don't even care I use six of them for napkins and they're like oh I'll get you one and who got me one shecky you got one of shck jackets and I love like and I wear it I decided you have that moment am I going to wear this or I'm going to put it in a museum and I was just like you know what I'm wearing it and I wear it and I love wearing it and you know I I'm so glad that before Shey left I got to express what that and I think he knew like and again I don't think he really cared about giving up that Jack you know what I mean like I don't think they cared about those jackets like people like you and me do yeah um but he was he was very kind to me yeah he loved his late night jacket like that was the thing he loved he loved some of his late night stuff that he had and like because he was a huge collector as well like massive massive massive collector but he loved he wore his late night jacket he loved his late night one and and and uh uh but yeah so so so um you know I appreciate I will never ever and and by the way for those who do not like I've got a few people I don't know if you remember this Tarantino was on it might have been Leno but I thought it was Letterman but now my memory is getting hazy promoting four rooms or it might have been a movie after four rooms and he was talking about ha haters and and talking about the backlash that he was receiving how people would say hey yeah I hated your part in four rooms and he's like oh you didn't like my story you didn't like this no you you acted i' hate it I hate you I hate this and Tarantino was telling the story on panel somehow I've certainly experienced this okay uh and I'm going to pass the buck here there are some people who are just like like ravenously mad that finally a letterman podcast comes out and it's this idiot that's hosting it uh blame Scott you could blame Scott Scott's the reason that that connected with like hits the whole if it goes back to One Singular Source it was because I like so many people love the last days of Letterman so much that I had to actually reach out to Scott and this is the thing if you if you look at his catalog and you see a book that you think you might identify with reach out to Scott have a conversation he does answer and talk about these things he's so great at at at at sharing the enthusiasm he let me tell my story about Letterman a month before he retired and and and when I was in the audience and all that that was how Scott and I bonded and the friendship kind of blossomed from there and then he'll sign a book and personalize it to you and send it to you and you'll have an amazing experience reading it and if you do it that way he'll make more money than he does off Amazon so that being said what is the best way for people to buy books directly from you Scott so the company's website is Tucker DS for David and Scott the owners uh press Tucker DS press.com or you can go to Scott Ryan Productions also that's my personal uh one and um yeah you know because I am a small business it means a lot and so I do I take it seriously I know how much people don't want to buy a book and I know how expensive it is to do it but also I do put a lot into it it's not something I I don't just pump them out even though I've done a lot of books I think of Steve Martin someone said to him like how are you writing these books and doing all this stuff and Steve Martin said yeah but I don't do anything else like that's all I do and that's pretty much who I am so I always think that's a good line like I what do you mean like I I mean this Conan idea is in my head and I'm just thinking about it do I do a comedy book do I do this like you know that's my work that's what's going on so I love to do it and you know you've always been super kind to me um and having me on these shows and and letting me spout off on these things of late night which late night means more to me than it should especially even now after all these years but it's in my DNA and a lot of it does come through you know in the book and I guess I'm just a a gen xer from the 90s and I think when you look at my work now that I have like 10 books out that's what it really is it's painting that portrait of all these artists that affected me and I think so many of us from the generation that no one's paying attention to you know we just kind of moved back because it was in our nature to not not put our finger in in trouble you know we just kind of mocked it from the side and went about our business and that's what I'm still doing so and me you know you're saying why is this idiot hosting a letterman thing that's how I feel about hosting the mass and tigers thing like this this jerk should not be hosting a sports show of any kind but when you have honesty and interest and and we certainly learned that from Dave absolutely you can you can make um television that's worth watching not this interview of course I mean not this not even close gotcha everybody who are watching gotcha not even close um well I I I can't tell you how you know how much I appreciate you it's fun to say it publicly you know how much I uh you've inspired me so much again with all seriousness this show doesn't exist without you without that book without uh your friendship and and um I just I can't thank you enough to go back to the kindness thing because that's your that's your religion that's your philosophy and it has never never been your not not it's never not been your Norm star where you are one of the kindest people I've ever met and and uh thank you for that you're an advocate well you're an advocate for it you you you talk about how kindness can can change everything and uh and it can give you things that just other things can't buy and and kindness has certainly done that um you're a wonderful advocate for that you're an amazing writer uh I appreciate you beyond measure and I'm so glad that you're willing to keep coming on this thing because I'm going to keep inviting you and and uh as these new moments happen you're one of my favorite people to talk about them so thank you very much Scott Ryan for being a part of the Letterman podcast again and what was your name uh yeah Mike nice to meet you oh ni thank you as well I I appreciate it I'm the guy from the place I'm the guy from the place back at that time um the other thing too oh I gotta say this too when I see footage of you at a Twin Peaks thing with a full theater and and and and and and uh some of the principles from Twin Peaks there and I see you up with the microphone running things I I there is a there is a part of me that is just so proud of you but also like envious because it's like oh that guy is doing something so fun right now like you you seem to be 100% in your element because you're taking all of this knowledge that you have seemingly that's just available to you and you're playing with it pointless sure you're pring did you see me sing at the Double R Diner I did I did see that it's one of the craziest things I and I haven't done a Twin Peaks event since then because part of me is like I don't know that I can top that I sang A David Lynch song in the actual place where they filmed a r and it was nervous for me but I went full performance speaking of Conan and the hot wings like I just was like if you do this you got to go full on and I went full on and and I do get to do crazy things like that and I appreciate it I feel lucky and um as we always say like both of us we got so much of that from Dave so to come on this podcast and promote books that have nothing to do with Dave and really makes me happy right back at you my friend uh I'll do a really really quick outro and then we'll say our goodbye privately um this is exactly why we do the show and um and again I wouldn't be doing the show if it wasn't for that guy and I say tongue and Chek blame him H well you know what that ship has sailed we're two years into this sucker now and uh and and I can't tell you um how much it means to me to have the memory bank that I have and it includes so many of you as well I just want to say thank you so much for this past two years for everybody who's reached out and uh and make new friends you know who have never met necessarily in person but it's so much fun doing this and uh please let's keep the community growing so we got the Facebook group and we'll find other ways to create communities whatnot but uh uh again hellodd deli.com our only sponsor please go to them as well this has been another episode of the Letterman podcast with Mike Chisum coincidentally I am Mike Chism thank you and good night so do you think maybe we could get a cup of coffee sometime or maybe you know like go out and get some cr's pizza or maybe I do you like to play Monopoly or do how do you feel what are you doing what not I just I thought people get to spend time with the trophy when they come to the signing we're going to have to put in glass why we're going to have to B in glass I touched it once it was it was only my players only players get back